Is science infallible or is science for sale - Page 5 | Scienc…
Is science infallible or is science for sale
    • PopadaPill [900338]
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    Posted on 14:27:46 - 02/04/18 (6 years ago)
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    PopadaPill [900338]







    Hmmm,how many Gods are here for you

    MachineGunSteve [184119]

    Those two are closer to god than the make believe concoctions that most organized religions have come up with, and they both advocate that we get our asses busy figuring out a way off this rock, as the only true purpose for life is the continuation of the species... that is my only point... I don't care what else either of them is/was up too beyond that simple message.

    PopadaPill [900338]

    To you,not to me..My eyes work

    Good goy,This rock..we might as well strip it as thee Gods are going fly you to Mars

    A true Space cadet trained by Disney and Co

    MachineGunSteve [184119]

    To you, not to me.

    See it works both ways, Popa...

    I am jaded and cynical, but I am no Space Cadet.

    I pray thee pray to whichever alter thee see fit, while I search for the exit.
    It certainly does.

    IMO you really really are...i can spot one,coz i loved this shit too until something kept knocking on my door.

    How much tax money do you think should go to clearing space junk?Dunna want it falling on yer head now..

    May be Elong Can make a space car with a big hoover on the front next time.

    Yee Gods
    Last edited by PopadaPill on 14:28:19 - 02/04/18
    • MachineGunSteve [184119]
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    Posted on 14:43:45 - 02/04/18 (6 years ago)
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    PopadaPill [900338]







    Hmmm,how many Gods are here for you

    MachineGunSteve [184119]

    Those two are closer to god than the make believe concoctions that most organized religions have come up with, and they both advocate that we get our asses busy figuring out a way off this rock, as the only true purpose for life is the continuation of the species... that is my only point... I don't care what else either of them is/was up too beyond that simple message.

    PopadaPill [900338]

    To you,not to me..My eyes work

    Good goy,This rock..we might as well strip it as thee Gods are going fly you to Mars

    A true Space cadet trained by Disney and Co

    MachineGunSteve [184119]

    To you, not to me.

    See it works both ways, Popa...

    I am jaded and cynical, but I am no Space Cadet.

    I pray thee pray to whichever alter thee see fit, while I search for the exit.

    PopadaPill [900338]

    It certainly does.

    IMO you really really are...i can spot one,coz i loved this shit too until something kept knocking on my door.

    How much tax money do you think should go to clearing space junk?Dunna want it falling on yer head now..

    May be Elong Can make a space car with a big hoover on the front next time.

    Yee Gods
    In my opinion you are what is known as a "convert", which is fine, but just because you think you are now on some righteous path or other... that doesn't mean you might not be wrong again... does it?

    Space junk is a great source of reusable resources, so what is not to like about trying to get it back in a reusable form?

    But, again... I don't care about specifics here... I am only concerned with their overall message... We humans need to at least try to figure out how to get out there, because no matter how wonderfully we treat this planet (and we aren't, but...) it will eventually happen that some event or other will take us out. Just ask any T-Rex you can find.

    Eyes wide open over here, and you know how I know that? Because I am aware of the possibility that I don't know shit, and that everything I think I think I know could be complete nonsense, and I am comfortable enough in my own mind to admit it.
    Last edited by MachineGunSteve on 14:45:18 - 02/04/18

    Earth Mother, Ganesha, Ra, Zeus, Jupiter, Mithra, Jesus, Allah,... GOD...  and the Internet God of conspiracies... I beg you:

     

    Please protect me from your followers.

     

     

    • PopadaPill [900338]
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    Posted on 14:50:18 - 02/04/18 (6 years ago)
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    'I QUOTE OTHERS SHIT THATS HOW I KNOW HOW CLEVER I AM'^

    T REX DIED BRO,thats going be us...the Whole She-Bang here.

    Im whatever you want me bee,buzzz
    • MachineGunSteve [184119]
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    Posted on 15:01:46 - 02/04/18 (6 years ago)
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    PopadaPill [900338]

    'I QUOTE OTHERS SHIT THATS HOW I KNOW HOW CLEVER I AM'^

    T REX DIED BRO,thats going be us...the Whole She-Bang here.

    Im whatever you want me bee,buzzz
    Where did I quote others shit? 

    Whatever happened to T-Rex is simply a warning to us, and should serve as such, but hey you can pray that it won't happen. Maybe that will work for you. I don't know.

    Post some more pictures. Maybe that will calm you down.

    Earth Mother, Ganesha, Ra, Zeus, Jupiter, Mithra, Jesus, Allah,... GOD...  and the Internet God of conspiracies... I beg you:

     

    Please protect me from your followers.

     

     

    • PopadaPill [900338]
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    Posted on 15:03:43 - 02/04/18 (6 years ago)
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    PopadaPill [900338]

    'I QUOTE OTHERS SHIT THATS HOW I KNOW HOW CLEVER I AM'^

    T REX DIED BRO,thats going be us...the Whole She-Bang here.

    Im whatever you want me bee,buzzz

    MachineGunSteve [184119]

    Where did I quote others shit?

    Whatever happened to T-Rex is simply a warning to us, and should serve as such, but hey you can pray that it won't happen. Maybe that will work for you. I don't know.

    Post some more pictures. Maybe that will calm you down.




    This cracked me up,remember it?



    Hehe,whatta ride

    Last edited by PopadaPill on 22:32:49 - 08/04/18
    • RasAlGhul [1448500]
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    Posted on 15:24:18 - 02/04/18 (6 years ago)
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    Science itself is a conceptual. It helps us to make sense of patterns and other seemingly chaotic things. It is not the absolute truth. Only God is.

    If you can see this, you are viewing the forums badly.

    • PopadaPill [900338]
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    Posted on 16:49:14 - 02/04/18 (6 years ago)
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    Kevin 'Im gay!' Spaceys mums a dead ringer for the Hawk(well one of them)
    Last edited by PopadaPill on 17:30:36 - 02/04/18
    • Quickdraw [915500]
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    Posted on 19:27:07 - 02/04/18 (6 years ago)
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    Quickdraw [915500]

    You absolutely should question the science and I am glad that you are! So, for example, regarding global warming. If you are questioning that current global warming trends are caused by humans, here is a bunch of evidence, in addition to the book I already sent you, showing how it is cause pretty much entirely by humans:

    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2000JD000028/full

    http://journals.ametsoc.org/doi/abs/10.1175/1520-0442%282004%29017%3C3721%3ACONAAF%3E2.0.CO%3B2

    http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.167.2337&rep=rep1&type=pdf

    http://thingsbreak.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/anthropogenic-and-natural-warming-inferred-from-changes-in-earths-energy-balance.pdf

    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2011GL050226/full

    http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs00382-012-1585-8

    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/jgrd.50239/abstract

    http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs00382-016-3079-6

    Even if every single author in this list is a corrupt piece of shit, there is an abundance of data showing how global warming is caused by humans. If rather than questioning the science, you are accusing it of being wrong, you need to present evidence that shows why these studies are wrong. That is why I offered you the supercomputer, so that there is absolutely no excuse. You can either use data and evidence to prove these studies wrong, or stop making baseless accusations.

    LawOfOne [266775]

    Antarctic core samples such as Vostok and the EPICA prove that the earths temps go up and they go down as do ice levels. You are looking at global warming(lol) through a microscope that Al Gore sold you. Cycles up and cycles down!. For example over the 2000 years, we are only slightly, and I mean ever so slightly above average when looking at the evidence the trees give us. The MWP was not caused by humans and then temps dropped. For every article that you produce I can produce another peer reviewed article from another person that says the opposite. The reason for this is there is zero conciseness in science that these are man made events. Many will tell you as much, Including a weather expert like John Coleman. He knew much more than you on the subject as do many others. I will take their expert opinions. Sit down Mr. Gore!

    Quickdraw [915500]

    That is exactly right, the earths tempreature has cycled up and down in the past naturally. That does not mean that current warming is not caused by humans. It also does not mean thqt we should not worry. For example, during previous warm periods most of North America was underwater, it was a vast shallow sea! That would be a huge problem for us if the earth warms enough that it happens again. The reason we need to be concerned with current, human caused global warming is that our society was built around the current conditions. Most major cities are located near rivers so that they have a water supply. What will we do when the climate changes atmospheric circulation so that rainfall patterns change and the rivers are located in different places? What will we do when Florida is underwater? These are all things that will be incredibly expensive to deal with. It would be much cheaper to prevent these changes by stopping global warming now.

    I have been advocating that you investigate the science on your own so that you dont have to rely on an authority to tell you what to think because I think that is the best way to prevent the abuses of authority that you are worried about. But if you only want to trust an expert, I do in fact know what I am talking about. I am a scientist with a PhD who studies the impacts of global warming, so I am much more qualified to speak on the subject than John Coleman who only had a bachelors degree in journalism and based his views on things that are demonstrably false. If you can produce a bunch of peer reviewed articles that global warming is not caused by humans I would be happy to read them.

    MachineGunSteve [184119]

    Let's say I accept the fact that you know what you are talking about, and I accept the fact that humans are to cause for the minor fluctuations in temperature that are currently causing climate change to be more robust than is attributable to natural factors... so what?

    The problem I have with all of this is that there is no practical fix that I can conceive of or have read about that is achievable in a manner that probably won't cause a major collapse of our economy and way of life.

    If we in the USA suddenly stopped eating meat... all of us, and stopped driving to work... all of us... and stopped doing everything we are doing (impossible really) what impact would that have? Maybe a global reduction of 20% for our carbon footprint... say 25%... but then we may as well give the keys to the Russians and Chinese to the White House, and all march lock step into the nearest ocean.

    We are a capitalist nation (I guess... we try to be, or we call ourselves one... not sure anymore), so the market will eventually fix the problem in the USA. Solar panels are popping up on every roof in my neighborhood. Hybrid cars are everywhere... laws are being past to end plastic use in retail... etc., etc. What else should we do doctor?

    I would love for someone with an actual plan to run for office. Not someone with anecdotes, campaign slogans, and rhetoric, but an actual thought out plan to show us during their campaigning that looks like it would work without ruin to the national economy. I would vote for that person regardless of party. But I have yet to see that person, because there is no plan... there is only using the issue as a wedge and political gain, and that is just as bad as denying there is a problem in my opinion.

    Quickdraw [915500]

    This is the crux of the problem, and I believe the real reason why many conservatives choose to believe that global warming isn't real. The market cannot fix global warming because the market is based on the idea of an unlimited commons, so that if everybody does what is in their best interest things will work out. But the world is not an unlimited commons and if we pollute it we are ultimately ruining things for ourselves (read about the concept: tragedy of the commons). In order to avoid this we need to agree to fix it as a group (i.e. government intervention). One good way is a carbon tax of which there are many well thought out proposals, here is one since it is a science subforum from tye union of concerned scientists: https://www.ucsusa.org/our-work/global-warming/solutions/global-warming-solutions-reduce-emissions#.Wr-tbHNlBdZ

    So yeah there will be economic upheaval for people and companies that are based on fossil fuels, but for the vast majority of people there wont be much effect and we would be far better positioned for the future. If we do nothing (i.e. try to let the market fix global warming) then the economic consequences are far greater. The locations of our cities would need to be moved, crops will be far less productive. A scenario like that movie interstellar is possible where we can no longer grow enough food to feed ourselves. The economic consequences of inaction are far far greater.

    MachineGunSteve [184119]

    "In order to avoid this we need to agree to fix it as a group (i.e. government intervention)."

    There isn't a single world government, thus it is a near impossibility that there will ever be a unified agreement on fixing this issue. We in the USA don't whale anymore, but Japan still does. We in the USA don't grind Rhino horns into powder to keep our dicks hard, and other nations on earth up until recent times didn't contribute to climate change to the same degree that the USA has in the past for lots of reasons. Each and every nation on this globe, past and present, has contributed to the mess we are in, and only nature can, and eventually will fix it.

    I know how all the scenarios play out, and I honestly believe it is inevitable.

    We should be listening to Elon Musk, and the late Mr. Hawkings, imho.
    Well that is what the Paris agreement is for, to build an international coalition where everybody agrees to work together to fix the problem. The only reason that deal didnt have a strong enforcement mechanism is because the US refused to participate if it did. 

    It seems awfully selfish to tell our kids and grandkids that we would doom this planet to be unfit for human habitation for them so that we can enjoy the fruits of burning all the fossil fuel we can get our hands on.
    • MachineGunSteve [184119]
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    Posted on 00:36:07 - 03/04/18 (6 years ago)
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    LawOfOne [266775]

    Antarctic core samples such as Vostok and the EPICA prove that the earths temps go up and they go down as do ice levels. You are looking at global warming(lol) through a microscope that Al Gore sold you. Cycles up and cycles down!. For example over the 2000 years, we are only slightly, and I mean ever so slightly above average when looking at the evidence the trees give us. The MWP was not caused by humans and then temps dropped. For every article that you produce I can produce another peer reviewed article from another person that says the opposite. The reason for this is there is zero conciseness in science that these are man made events. Many will tell you as much, Including a weather expert like John Coleman. He knew much more than you on the subject as do many others. I will take their expert opinions. Sit down Mr. Gore!

    Quickdraw [915500]

    That is exactly right, the earths tempreature has cycled up and down in the past naturally. That does not mean that current warming is not caused by humans. It also does not mean thqt we should not worry. For example, during previous warm periods most of North America was underwater, it was a vast shallow sea! That would be a huge problem for us if the earth warms enough that it happens again. The reason we need to be concerned with current, human caused global warming is that our society was built around the current conditions. Most major cities are located near rivers so that they have a water supply. What will we do when the climate changes atmospheric circulation so that rainfall patterns change and the rivers are located in different places? What will we do when Florida is underwater? These are all things that will be incredibly expensive to deal with. It would be much cheaper to prevent these changes by stopping global warming now.

    I have been advocating that you investigate the science on your own so that you dont have to rely on an authority to tell you what to think because I think that is the best way to prevent the abuses of authority that you are worried about. But if you only want to trust an expert, I do in fact know what I am talking about. I am a scientist with a PhD who studies the impacts of global warming, so I am much more qualified to speak on the subject than John Coleman who only had a bachelors degree in journalism and based his views on things that are demonstrably false. If you can produce a bunch of peer reviewed articles that global warming is not caused by humans I would be happy to read them.

    MachineGunSteve [184119]

    Let's say I accept the fact that you know what you are talking about, and I accept the fact that humans are to cause for the minor fluctuations in temperature that are currently causing climate change to be more robust than is attributable to natural factors... so what?

    The problem I have with all of this is that there is no practical fix that I can conceive of or have read about that is achievable in a manner that probably won't cause a major collapse of our economy and way of life.

    If we in the USA suddenly stopped eating meat... all of us, and stopped driving to work... all of us... and stopped doing everything we are doing (impossible really) what impact would that have? Maybe a global reduction of 20% for our carbon footprint... say 25%... but then we may as well give the keys to the Russians and Chinese to the White House, and all march lock step into the nearest ocean.

    We are a capitalist nation (I guess... we try to be, or we call ourselves one... not sure anymore), so the market will eventually fix the problem in the USA. Solar panels are popping up on every roof in my neighborhood. Hybrid cars are everywhere... laws are being past to end plastic use in retail... etc., etc. What else should we do doctor?

    I would love for someone with an actual plan to run for office. Not someone with anecdotes, campaign slogans, and rhetoric, but an actual thought out plan to show us during their campaigning that looks like it would work without ruin to the national economy. I would vote for that person regardless of party. But I have yet to see that person, because there is no plan... there is only using the issue as a wedge and political gain, and that is just as bad as denying there is a problem in my opinion.

    Quickdraw [915500]

    This is the crux of the problem, and I believe the real reason why many conservatives choose to believe that global warming isn't real. The market cannot fix global warming because the market is based on the idea of an unlimited commons, so that if everybody does what is in their best interest things will work out. But the world is not an unlimited commons and if we pollute it we are ultimately ruining things for ourselves (read about the concept: tragedy of the commons). In order to avoid this we need to agree to fix it as a group (i.e. government intervention). One good way is a carbon tax of which there are many well thought out proposals, here is one since it is a science subforum from tye union of concerned scientists: https://www.ucsusa.org/our-work/global-warming/solutions/global-warming-solutions-reduce-emissions#.Wr-tbHNlBdZ

    So yeah there will be economic upheaval for people and companies that are based on fossil fuels, but for the vast majority of people there wont be much effect and we would be far better positioned for the future. If we do nothing (i.e. try to let the market fix global warming) then the economic consequences are far greater. The locations of our cities would need to be moved, crops will be far less productive. A scenario like that movie interstellar is possible where we can no longer grow enough food to feed ourselves. The economic consequences of inaction are far far greater.

    MachineGunSteve [184119]

    "In order to avoid this we need to agree to fix it as a group (i.e. government intervention)."

    There isn't a single world government, thus it is a near impossibility that there will ever be a unified agreement on fixing this issue. We in the USA don't whale anymore, but Japan still does. We in the USA don't grind Rhino horns into powder to keep our dicks hard, and other nations on earth up until recent times didn't contribute to climate change to the same degree that the USA has in the past for lots of reasons. Each and every nation on this globe, past and present, has contributed to the mess we are in, and only nature can, and eventually will fix it.

    I know how all the scenarios play out, and I honestly believe it is inevitable.

    We should be listening to Elon Musk, and the late Mr. Hawkings, imho.

    Quickdraw [915500]

    Well that is what the Paris agreement is for, to build an international coalition where everybody agrees to work together to fix the problem. The only reason that deal didnt have a strong enforcement mechanism is because the US refused to participate if it did.

    It seems awfully selfish to tell our kids and grandkids that we would doom this planet to be unfit for human habitation for them so that we can enjoy the fruits of burning all the fossil fuel we can get our hands on.
    An agreement is only an agreement when everyone agrees.

    And it does seem selfish to tell our grandkids that, but it seems selfish today that our grandparents cut down all the rain forests, and detonated a nuclear bomb in an effort to combat tyranny around the globe, and gave us the legacy of the Balfour Declaration to contend with... Every generation has to fix the problems of the ones that preceded it I suppose.

    And so it goes.
    Last edited by MachineGunSteve on 00:42:16 - 03/04/18

    Earth Mother, Ganesha, Ra, Zeus, Jupiter, Mithra, Jesus, Allah,... GOD...  and the Internet God of conspiracies... I beg you:

     

    Please protect me from your followers.

     

     

    • PopadaPill [900338]
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    Posted on 11:08:05 - 17/04/18 (6 years ago)
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    lol
    • Names_SlickBack [1842341]
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    Posted on 11:18:19 - 09/05/18 (5 years ago)
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    We can just send prison inmates to clean all the space trash. Sloved.   M_F_G
    • Ayelis [2115725]
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    Posted on 23:18:18 - 10/05/18 (5 years ago)
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    Obviously science is "for sale", buy a beaker. Case closed.
    Anyone who wants to make a buck can pay any corruptible idiot with a PhD and bills to pay to publish a study saying anything they like. That study likely won't be repeatable once it's subjected to peer-review and meta-analysis (the REAL tools of science), so the scientific community at large will laugh them out of the industry and they'll lose all credibility... But that won't stop the news media from reporting on the false ideas that "Cannabis oil cures cancer 100%" or "Eating genetically modified food will turn you into a fish-person" or whatever.

    TLDR; Just because ONE STUDY says something doesn't make it true.
    • BlnkSugarSocket [2018522]
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    Posted on 03:07:34 - 30/06/18 (5 years ago)
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    Ayelis [2115725]

    Obviously science is "for sale", buy a beaker. Case closed.
    Anyone who wants to make a buck can pay any corruptible idiot with a PhD and bills to pay to publish a study saying anything they like. That study likely won't be repeatable once it's subjected to peer-review and meta-analysis (the REAL tools of science), so the scientific community at large will laugh them out of the industry and they'll lose all credibility... But that won't stop the news media from reporting on the false ideas that "Cannabis oil cures cancer 100%" or "Eating genetically modified food will turn you into a fish-person" or whatever.

    TLDR; Just because ONE STUDY says something doesn't make it true.
    Ah, but if such an entity can afford to pay off ONE scientist, how many of their "peers" can they also afford? Let's say a few are goodie-two-shoes and don't want to be on the take. They have families, don't they? Have you heard what they did to Tyrone Hayes? He is a very RARE exception. Even better, EVEN IF you stay true to science, your findings may end up a meme and you become a laughingstock anyway. ("Gay Frogs" meme was based DIRECTLY on Hayes' work).

    Knowing the most basic of scientific principle ("cause and effect", for example) can cause you to question how much we know is accurate. After all, the distribution of wealth on a planetary scale itself is rather biased, with over 50% of all wealth being controlled by less than 1 % of the population. My point here is that ad populum appeal and consider the source fallacies, rampant though they may be, are no substitute for logic and rational thought. Ultimately things like logic and mathematics are still the most reliable tools of science. People are fallable. They are not.
    • Dire [2091491]
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    Posted on 01:29:33 - 01/07/18 (5 years ago)
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    Science is infallible,

    The "scientific method" requires "Proof" and the ability to replicate results via repeated experimentation. Even then though it is only regarded as "proof beyond reasonable doubt" which leaves the possibility of "un-reasonable doubt". At no point are things considered "known" and as it is always open to the idea that it may be flawed in every way, it can be regarded as "infallible"

    Some may say it is fallible, in the sense that it can cause miss-conceptions, though this fault lies with the person holding the miss-conception not with the "method" of science :p 

    fwUaiQx.png

    • Hirondelle [2149469]
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    Posted on 23:11:08 - 13/07/18 (5 years ago)
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    Dire [2091491]

    Science is infallible,

    The "scientific method" requires "Proof" and the ability to replicate results via repeated experimentation. Even then though it is only regarded as "proof beyond reasonable doubt" which leaves the possibility of "un-reasonable doubt". At no point are things considered "known" and as it is always open to the idea that it may be flawed in every way, it can be regarded as "infallible"

    Some may say it is fallible, in the sense that it can cause miss-conceptions, though this fault lies with the person holding the miss-conception not with the "method" of science :p 
    By the "scientific method" I'm guessing you mean that of the Natural Sciences. Even if we reject the idea of it providing us with knowledge, we find that the logic on which the whole nature of investigation stands is flawed. What I mean is that the mistakes we stumble upon in results are not only due to errors in designing or doing the experiments, but sometimes also to inconsistences in the mothod itself.

    Why do I say this? If we were to go with a purely logical approach, we could break down any form of reasoning to: 1) If A, then B. 2) A. Conclusion: B. This is what we call deduction (although many also give that name to abduction), and it's the only logically sound form of reasoning the scientific method uses. Now, if we wanted to build our whole understanding of the universe by deducing, firstly, we would need a handful of statements we assume to be correct (axioms); if we committed the slightest inconsistence there, it could affect the whole theory. Exact Sciences use this sort of systems, but Natural Sciences have the Universe to answer to. Since, without a solid, objective method to percieve the Universe (there isn't such thing), we in fact can't decide which statements are the absolute truth, scientists decided to put two other formulas into use.

    Abduction (which, as I stated before, is often called deduction), has the logical form of 1) If A, then B. 2) B. 3) A at least as likely as any other cause for B (this observation is not based on logic, but on the evaluation of uncontrolled agents). Conclusion: A. This, as you can surely appreciate, is not solid reasoning, in terms of our (my?) ideal axiomatic system. Abduction provides results which can be continuously debated among the scientific community and is the main essence of the "un-reasonable doubt" you pointed out in your post. It does, however, successfully give us information regarding the universe, granted the apparent plausibility of a cause over others. Still, we are missing a way to get (somewhat) reliable information out of our observations, which brings us to my favourite method: induction.

    Not to be confused with induction in Maths, this is probably the oldest formula I'll be mentioning in here, and constitutes the basis of our prediction of the future. It looks like this: 1) In many instances, when A, also B. Conclusion: If A, then B. It's hilarious just to think of it as logically consistent.

    Now, these three formulas (and some logical equivalents which I'll skip) are what the scientific method of Natural Sciences is made of. As you can see, two of them are beyond faulty, and still, they are the ones that get us to connect with the Universe. We may say that the problem is in logic itself, but if we rebuilt it around this we'd be just ripping a solid discipline off its rigor, instead of granting it to a more... flexible area. In conclusion, then, even if we disregard every piece of information the natural method gives us, we will still find faults in its very logic. I wouldn't say it's infallible at all, but I certainly believe it's a very good way of grasping the mechanics of the Universe.
    • Dire [2091491]
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    Posted on 00:09:21 - 14/07/18 (5 years ago)
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    My whole basis of reasoning is this. 

    "You cannot be wrong if you only ever talk in terms of possibility"


    All science is only ever a "deduction" of what possibly may be. Not a classification of "What is" 
    Regardless of what "It" is, If it is definitive, then It is fallible (in my opinion) ,

    By making the clear point of adding, "beyond reasonable doubt" it means it doesn't matter what is expressed. It remains open to the idea that it may be wrong and therefore cannot be inaccurate (I think), and so it is more than likely "in-fallible" (or so my theory goes) 

    The argument then becomes which doubt is reasonable and which is not, and this is based purely on opinion. 
    -
    Will read through that again... a lot of info there....

    -

    Edits - Points regarding Hirondelles "thesis"


    "solid reasoning" 
    -You say it is not solid reasoning, i say solid reasoning is not a thing, far too definitive :p
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    -
    "I wouldn't say it's infallible at all"
    -You are applying the fallibility of the individual to the logical process of "abduction/deduction" 

    -

    I would say then.....
    It is infallible (theoretically) when an infallible logic is applied to it. OF COURSE it becomes fallible when you apply fallible logic to it.

    Aka, Don't hate on the tool, Its the workmans fault :p (or summin like that)

    -

    Ooooh you can quote me on this....

    "Science is possibly the most likely candidate to be a manifestation of GOD, In my opinion"

    True or false? Lmao....
    Last edited by Dire on 13:59:15 - 14/07/18

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    • PopadaPill [900338]
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    Posted on 10:41:39 - 16/07/18 (5 years ago)
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    Wuts the game here i wonder
    • Valkjosandi [1498789]
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    Posted on 17:39:56 - 28/12/18 (5 years ago)
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    Science shouldn't be worshipped as if it is some God.
    The primary reason being that science (which I understand you to mean material science) has a limited scope.

    There are spiritual realities out there and for that you require spiritual science, but because the result is self-realization, there's not a very communicable way to convey to result to someone who doesn't have enough faith to take up the process in the first place.
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