Madgod [1733719]

I used to believe in and hope for the implementation of a two-state solution, but now I don't really view it as a possibility. The reality of the situation is this:

1. Israel isn't going anywhere, and they have just as much a claim to the area as the "Palestinians" do, if not more so

2. The Palestinian people in large have not yet accepted this, and they desire nothing but the destruction of Israel

3. The Israelis are the only one who have been consistently at the negotiating table

4. The modern Palestinian people have grown up in a barbaric culture, and I have no faith in the ability of any Palestinian leader to both desire a peaceful solution and to be capable of winning over the hearts and minds of the others.

5. This means that nothing is going to change in this regard for at least the next 30 years

6. If the Palestinian people laid down their guns, there would be no more war. If the Israelis did, there would be no more Israel.

7. Therefor it seems logical to me that the best option is for Israel to forcibly establish a government which eventually oversees all of greater Israel.

The Palestinian people are just going to have to learn to get along, and abandon their dream of Islamic supremacy in the levant

Sidgar [1828507]

1. Israel isn't going anywhere
2. The vast majority of Palestinians accept this and favor a peaceful solution
3. Israel, with America as the "unbiased mediator" beside them, have never negotiated in good faith
4. the modern Palestinian people have grown up under military occupation and deprived of dignity
5. Israel has to be pressured into making changes, or things will continue as they are
6. If Palestinians laid down arms, they would remain subjugated. If Israel laid down arms, America will send more arms and even put boots on the ground if needed, but Palestinians might have better lives
7. "our plan was always to annex all the occupied territories and damned be international law"

Asbestos [2605613]

#2: Which Palestinians accept this and favor a peaceful solution? Do you represent them? Are you able to bargain with the world on their behalf? How will you resolve the religious issues with respect to religious texts proclaiming ownership of the region?

Asbestos [2605613]

#2: Which Palestinians accept this and favor a peaceful solution? Do you represent them? Are you able to bargain with the world on their behalf? How will you resolve the religious issues with respect to religious texts proclaiming ownership of the region?

Sidgar [1828507]

Based on polling data that is publicly available and frequently cited, Palestinians do favor a peaceful solution instead of endless violence. Deal with it.

Asbestos [2605613]

#2: Which Palestinians accept this and favor a peaceful solution? Do you represent them? Are you able to bargain with the world on their behalf? How will you resolve the religious issues with respect to religious texts proclaiming ownership of the region?

Sidgar [1828507]

Based on polling data that is publicly available and frequently cited, Palestinians do favor a peaceful solution instead of endless violence. Deal with it.

Halrian [3023326]

Radicalism within the region cannot be truly contested as there are lots of outsiders intervention on addition to hatred spread through governing bodies of Palestinians and radical individuals within Israel.However,what people forget is that unlike in Gaza,Israel has democracy and soft heart for criminals.Deny the following all you want but lots of Hamas officials which are standing on the top of the military hand of Hamas were in Israeli jails and received good conditions,in my opinion way too good. Generations in Israel are free to do what they want,express their opinion and criticize their rulers,a country with such values is more peaceful than a leadership like Hamas which uses iron fist to silence it's people and treat them like objects.Critical thinking in democracy is supported,in dictatorships it's illegal.Critical thinking is the key for solving each dispute.

Asbestos [2605613]

#2: Which Palestinians accept this and favor a peaceful solution? Do you represent them? Are you able to bargain with the world on their behalf? How will you resolve the religious issues with respect to religious texts proclaiming ownership of the region?

Sidgar [1828507]

Based on polling data that is publicly available and frequently cited, Palestinians do favor a peaceful solution instead of endless violence. Deal with it.

Asbestos [2605613]

What polling data is that? Who or what organization is running around Gaza polling right now?

This is all I can find and it’s not that good. Do you have something better?

By 70 percent to 28 percent, Palestinians oppose a two-state solution — “the establishment of a Palestinian state alongside Israel.”
An even larger number — 76 percent to 21 percent — oppose a “one state solution …in which the two sides enjoy equal rights.”

Given a choice among three options for “ending the occupation and building an independent state,” 21 percent prefer “negotiations,” 22 percent “peaceful popular resistance” and 52 percent select “armed conflict.”

A 58 percent majority support a “return to the armed intifada [terrorism] and confrontations,” while 41 percent oppose such a move.

In short, Hamas’s leader receives substantially more support than Fatah’s President Abbas, but that reflects Abbas’s weakness more than Hamas’s strength. At the legislative level, with no candidates, only parties mentioned, the two large parties appear to be at parity.

But Palestinians find great fault with both major parties.

Their preferred leader is a convicted terrorist, and significant majorities of Palestinians support terrorism, with even larger numbers opposing both a two-state solution and one-state solution with equal rights for Jews and Arabs.

Peace seems to require some fundamental changes in public attitudes.

deadalus29 [2536273]

Can you present this data of yours? because publicly available data support the opposite claim - the Palestinians were offered a deal in which a vast majority (91-98%) of their true claims* were accepted, and they refused it. link

The propositions from the Israeli side kind of died out as a logical response to the fact the Palestinian elect leadership which wants to destroy Israel as its formal goal.

*True claim are claim which are not only a pretense to destroy Israel as Jewish and democratic state, like the right of return.

Asbestos [2605613]

#2: Which Palestinians accept this and favor a peaceful solution? Do you represent them? Are you able to bargain with the world on their behalf? How will you resolve the religious issues with respect to religious texts proclaiming ownership of the region?

Sidgar [1828507]

Based on polling data that is publicly available and frequently cited, Palestinians do favor a peaceful solution instead of endless violence. Deal with it.

Asbestos [2605613]

What polling data is that? Who or what organization is running around Gaza polling right now?

This is all I can find and it’s not that good. Do you have something better?

By 70 percent to 28 percent, Palestinians oppose a two-state solution — “the establishment of a Palestinian state alongside Israel.”
An even larger number — 76 percent to 21 percent — oppose a “one state solution …in which the two sides enjoy equal rights.”

Given a choice among three options for “ending the occupation and building an independent state,” 21 percent prefer “negotiations,” 22 percent “peaceful popular resistance” and 52 percent select “armed conflict.”

A 58 percent majority support a “return to the armed intifada [terrorism] and confrontations,” while 41 percent oppose such a move.

In short, Hamas’s leader receives substantially more support than Fatah’s President Abbas, but that reflects Abbas’s weakness more than Hamas’s strength. At the legislative level, with no candidates, only parties mentioned, the two large parties appear to be at parity.

But Palestinians find great fault with both major parties.

Their preferred leader is a convicted terrorist, and significant majorities of Palestinians support terrorism, with even larger numbers opposing both a two-state solution and one-state solution with equal rights for Jews and Arabs.

Peace seems to require some fundamental changes in public attitudes.

Sidgar [1828507]

Polling has been ongoing until October 6th. After that all we've seen are dead kids like that's normal.

Here's polling data from 2006 following the elections that Hamas won, before Israel made life hell for Gazans.
https://www.neareastconsulting.com/plc2006/results/index.html

Asbestos [2605613]

Is that 2006 poll your “polling data that is publicly available and frequently cited”?

deadalus29 [2536273]

Can you present this data of yours? because publicly available data support the opposite claim - the Palestinians were offered a deal in which a vast majority (91-98%) of their true claims* were accepted, and they refused it. link

The propositions from the Israeli side kind of died out as a logical response to the fact the Palestinian elect leadership which wants to destroy Israel as its formal goal.

*True claim are claim which are not only a pretense to destroy Israel as Jewish and democratic state, like the right of return.

Sidgar [1828507]

How does that logic reconcile with the fact that the Israeli government propped up Hamas precisely to avoid negotiations and kill the possibility of a Palestinian state?

Asbestos [2605613]

#2: Which Palestinians accept this and favor a peaceful solution? Do you represent them? Are you able to bargain with the world on their behalf? How will you resolve the religious issues with respect to religious texts proclaiming ownership of the region?

Sidgar [1828507]

Based on polling data that is publicly available and frequently cited, Palestinians do favor a peaceful solution instead of endless violence. Deal with it.

Asbestos [2605613]

What polling data is that? Who or what organization is running around Gaza polling right now?

This is all I can find and it’s not that good. Do you have something better?

By 70 percent to 28 percent, Palestinians oppose a two-state solution — “the establishment of a Palestinian state alongside Israel.”
An even larger number — 76 percent to 21 percent — oppose a “one state solution …in which the two sides enjoy equal rights.”

Given a choice among three options for “ending the occupation and building an independent state,” 21 percent prefer “negotiations,” 22 percent “peaceful popular resistance” and 52 percent select “armed conflict.”

A 58 percent majority support a “return to the armed intifada [terrorism] and confrontations,” while 41 percent oppose such a move.

In short, Hamas’s leader receives substantially more support than Fatah’s President Abbas, but that reflects Abbas’s weakness more than Hamas’s strength. At the legislative level, with no candidates, only parties mentioned, the two large parties appear to be at parity.

But Palestinians find great fault with both major parties.

Their preferred leader is a convicted terrorist, and significant majorities of Palestinians support terrorism, with even larger numbers opposing both a two-state solution and one-state solution with equal rights for Jews and Arabs.

Peace seems to require some fundamental changes in public attitudes.

Sidgar [1828507]

Polling has been ongoing until October 6th. After that all we've seen are dead kids like that's normal.

Here's polling data from 2006 following the elections that Hamas won, before Israel made life hell for Gazans.
https://www.neareastconsulting.com/plc2006/results/index.html

Steppenwulf [2960257]

Either they didn't know that the Hamas Charter specifically called for armed conflict to drive out Israel, or the "peace agreement" they were voting for was one in which Israel peacefully evacuates the Holy Land. Or, maybe they were deliberately lying to boost their propaganda, so that Hamas apologists and supporters could point to this poll 20 years later and say, "See? They want peace!"

Asbestos [2605613]

Is that 2006 poll your “polling data that is publicly available and frequently cited”?

Sidgar [1828507]

That was before they went under siege. Every poll taken before and after aggression against Palestinians by Israel shows the attacks reduce the confidence in the peace process. Your buddy Netanyahu knows this very well.

Steppenwulf [2960257]

Either they didn't know that the Hamas Charter specifically called for armed conflict to drive out Israel, or the "peace agreement" they were voting for was one in which Israel peacefully evacuates the Holy Land. Or, maybe they were deliberately lying to boost their propaganda, so that Hamas apologists and supporters could point to this poll 20 years later and say, "See? They want peace!"

Sidgar [1828507]

That's how everyone would see it, if everyone had only one brain cell to work with. My advice? Don't take people for idiots.

Vernunzio [730674]

So you are saying that Israeli aggression toward Palestine pushed Palestinian sentiment away from peace?

Could it also be possible that Palestinian intifadas, suicide bombings, rocket attacks, and categorical rejection of peace negotiations pushed Israeli sentiment away from peace at around the same time, and toward electing Netanyahu because he promised to protect them?

Vernunzio [730674]

So you are saying that Israeli aggression toward Palestine pushed Palestinian sentiment away from peace?

Could it also be possible that Palestinian intifadas, suicide bombings, rocket attacks, and categorical rejection of peace negotiations pushed Israeli sentiment away from peace at around the same time, and toward electing Netanyahu because he promised to protect them?

Sidgar [1828507]

That's the amazing narrative of the colonizer adopting a victimhood mentality in order to justice to themselves what they do. We've seen it already in past instances of European powers colonizing lands in Africa and Asia. Somehow they always claim the moral high ground against the people living under their boots and struggling to free themselves. And yes, every major Israeli military aggression against Palestinians is followed by an increase in support for armed struggle. Kinda obvious too.