My body my choice - Page 55 | Politics & Law | TORN
My body my choice
  • AE Basil_Drizzle [440317]Basil_Drizzle [440317]
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    Posted on 04:24:57 - 04/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Also Wrong thread :(
    Last edited by Basil_Drizzle on 09:57:17 - 04/09/21
  • SPCR Phil-I-P [2035498]Phil-I-P [2035498]
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    Posted on 09:17:57 - 04/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Phil-I-P [2035498]

    There's more to it than just blaming the voter, though. Those in power have a responsibility to the electorate, not the other way around. Vote shaming needs to become a thing of the past. It is that which undermines democracy.

    'Well, they voted him in!' isn't a valid argument either. In a two party system, voting for Trump based on his economic policies seems to somehow equate to also subscribing to his handling of the pandemic. Using the metric of how people voted compared to how those individuals believe the pandemic should be handled is a gross generalisation and intellectually dishonest.

    Still, great meme.

    angrysc0tsman12 [1099272]

    You have me at a loss my friend because I'm not blaming voters or looking to vote shame anyone.

    Phil-I-P [2035498]

    That is what the chart aims to do. It doesn't convey any real data, it's basically partisan clickbait.

    angrysc0tsman12 [1099272]

    Hardly partisan clickbait at all. Republicans are less likely than Democrats to be vaccinated. That's pretty easy to show.



    Source

    The logical proof would be as follows: The vaccine helps reduce deaths from COVID. If Republicans are less likely to be vaccinated than Democrats, then it would follow that higher percentage Republican counties would have higher COVID mortality rates.

    It is what it is. I'm not trying to answer the question of "why" Republicans are less vaccinated. The fact of the matter is they are.

    Read the author's original article.

    Phil-I-P [2035498]

    'The Delta wave is deadlier in Trump Country' is definitely clickbait. The chart shows deaths compared to how people voted (excluding Florida Nebraska and Alaska, whatever effect that has on the data). There is no scientific benefit to that chart, and only a political motive to present it in such a manner. The 2020 election wasn't solely based on the management of the pandemic, so I fail to see the relevance in the correlation.

    angrysc0tsman12 [1099272]

    The Delta variant wasn't a thing until July/August so this is the vaccine's first real stress test after a period of relative calm. Since states have had 7-8 months to administer vaccines, this is a good evaluation of those that have a high % of their population vaccinated vs low %. This isn't about the management of the pandemic. This is an evaluation of the efficacy of the vaccine broken down by county in the face of the Delta strain of the COVID virus. The takeaway is: A less vaccinated population experiences higher adverse reactions to the coronavirus.
    I agree with what you are saying. I'm not against the vaccine. 

    That isn't what that first chart says though. It isn't a representation of the population, only of those which voted. To come to such a conclusion, you must assume that in those counties, the people who didn't vote (or couldn't vote for voter suppression reasons) would have voted Trump at the same rate as they did in said counties.

    Also, the people in charge of lock down rules in those counties are the ones at fault, not necessarily the people who voted them in. Everybody can follow the rules to the letter, but if the rules are shit then very little benefit can come from it. Again, yes the electorate voted them in, but they don't make the rules. Blaming them suggests that the only reason people voted the way they did is because of what lock down rules would come from their candidate.

    People who are more likely to not be vaccinated are republican, I get it. I don't think anybody is disputing that. That is not the point of the first chart though. Manipulating figures for political point scoring is something you're normally on top of. I'm just trying to hold you to the same standard you hold others.

  • AE Basil_Drizzle [440317]Basil_Drizzle [440317]
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    Posted on 09:43:26 - 04/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    wrong thread
    Last edited by Basil_Drizzle on 09:53:24 - 04/09/21
  • AE Basil_Drizzle [440317]Basil_Drizzle [440317]
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    Posted on 09:53:06 - 04/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    -
    Last edited by Basil_Drizzle on 09:53:45 - 04/09/21
  • Viva Tyrion [1967379]Tyrion [1967379]
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    Posted on 14:15:46 - 04/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Oh gawd the politics involved even...

    So glad to stay unvaccinated, goodluck with your 10th+ booster shot soon, or daily pills from Pfizer lmao

    No adverse reactions here :)

    My body, my choice.
  • CR -El- [463504]-El- [463504]
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    Posted on 17:35:02 - 04/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Tyrion [1967379]

    Oh gawd the politics involved even...

    So glad to stay unvaccinated, goodluck with your 10th+ booster shot soon, or daily pills from Pfizer lmao

    No adverse reactions here :)

    My body, my choice.
    I seriously hope you catch it.

  • PoP angrysc0tsman12 [1099272]angrysc0tsman12 [1099272]
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    Posted on 17:47:38 - 04/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    angrysc0tsman12 [1099272]

    You have me at a loss my friend because I'm not blaming voters or looking to vote shame anyone.

    Phil-I-P [2035498]

    That is what the chart aims to do. It doesn't convey any real data, it's basically partisan clickbait.

    angrysc0tsman12 [1099272]

    Hardly partisan clickbait at all. Republicans are less likely than Democrats to be vaccinated. That's pretty easy to show.



    Source

    The logical proof would be as follows: The vaccine helps reduce deaths from COVID. If Republicans are less likely to be vaccinated than Democrats, then it would follow that higher percentage Republican counties would have higher COVID mortality rates.

    It is what it is. I'm not trying to answer the question of "why" Republicans are less vaccinated. The fact of the matter is they are.

    Read the author's original article.

    Phil-I-P [2035498]

    'The Delta wave is deadlier in Trump Country' is definitely clickbait. The chart shows deaths compared to how people voted (excluding Florida Nebraska and Alaska, whatever effect that has on the data). There is no scientific benefit to that chart, and only a political motive to present it in such a manner. The 2020 election wasn't solely based on the management of the pandemic, so I fail to see the relevance in the correlation.

    angrysc0tsman12 [1099272]

    The Delta variant wasn't a thing until July/August so this is the vaccine's first real stress test after a period of relative calm. Since states have had 7-8 months to administer vaccines, this is a good evaluation of those that have a high % of their population vaccinated vs low %. This isn't about the management of the pandemic. This is an evaluation of the efficacy of the vaccine broken down by county in the face of the Delta strain of the COVID virus. The takeaway is: A less vaccinated population experiences higher adverse reactions to the coronavirus.

    Phil-I-P [2035498]

    I agree with what you are saying. I'm not against the vaccine.

    That isn't what that first chart says though. It isn't a representation of the population, only of those which voted. To come to such a conclusion, you must assume that in those counties, the people who didn't vote (or couldn't vote for voter suppression reasons) would have voted Trump at the same rate as they did in said counties.

    Also, the people in charge of lock down rules in those counties are the ones at fault, not necessarily the people who voted them in. Everybody can follow the rules to the letter, but if the rules are shit then very little benefit can come from it. Again, yes the electorate voted them in, but they don't make the rules. Blaming them suggests that the only reason people voted the way they did is because of what lock down rules would come from their candidate.

    People who are more likely to not be vaccinated are republican, I get it. I don't think anybody is disputing that. That is not the point of the first chart though. Manipulating figures for political point scoring is something you're normally on top of. I'm just trying to hold you to the same standard you hold others.
    I'm not sure what you think is being manipulated here. There are no political points to be gained here. The graphic is pretty much as apolitical as it can be since it is reflecting accurate data. Since I'm a mad lad and like numbers, I'm in the process of replicating said graphic. The WIP draft can be found here. 

    Again, not sure where or why the topic of lockdowns keeps getting brought up as it is not germane here.
  • PoP angrysc0tsman12 [1099272]angrysc0tsman12 [1099272]
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    Posted on 17:48:05 - 04/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Tyrion [1967379]

    Oh gawd the politics involved even...

    So glad to stay unvaccinated, goodluck with your 10th+ booster shot soon, or daily pills from Pfizer lmao

    No adverse reactions here :)

    My body, my choice.

    -El- [463504]

    I seriously hope you catch it.

    Every vaccine needs a control group. Let's all thank Tyrion for biting the bullet on that one.
  • TuS™ Fistyboy [1733255]Fistyboy [1733255]
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    Posted on 15:54:18 - 05/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Just got the Jab, guess now Bill and Jeff are my lords and saviours
  • Viva Tyrion [1967379]Tyrion [1967379]
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    Posted on 09:53:24 - 06/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Tyrion [1967379]

    Oh gawd the politics involved even...

    So glad to stay unvaccinated, goodluck with your 10th+ booster shot soon, or daily pills from Pfizer lmao

    No adverse reactions here :)

    My body, my choice.

    -El- [463504]

    I seriously hope you catch it.

    Maybe I have already, I've had a cold or 2 in the last few years... 

    Recent Harvard study suggests I have more protection from Covid then through my natural immune system :)

    Imagine that eh, no shots or boosters needed even!
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    Posted on 10:21:43 - 06/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Tyrion [1967379]

    Oh gawd the politics involved even...

    So glad to stay unvaccinated, goodluck with your 10th+ booster shot soon, or daily pills from Pfizer lmao

    No adverse reactions here :)

    My body, my choice.

    -El- [463504]

    I seriously hope you catch it.

    Tyrion [1967379]

    Maybe I have already, I've had a cold or 2 in the last few years...

    Recent Harvard study suggests I have more protection from Covid then through my natural immune system :)

    Imagine that eh, no shots or boosters needed even!
    Maybe I have already

    Doubtful, and even if you did you wouldn't post about it.

    I have no issue watching Darwinism at work.
  • NS Capgros [2088627]Capgros [2088627]
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    Posted on 10:28:17 - 06/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Tyrion [1967379]

    Oh gawd the politics involved even...

    So glad to stay unvaccinated, goodluck with your 10th+ booster shot soon, or daily pills from Pfizer lmao

    No adverse reactions here :)

    My body, my choice.

    -El- [463504]

    I seriously hope you catch it.

    Tyrion [1967379]

    Maybe I have already, I've had a cold or 2 in the last few years...

    Recent Harvard study suggests I have more protection from Covid then through my natural immune system :)

    Imagine that eh, no shots or boosters needed even!
    I don't think the author of the article read the study properly, or he deliberately cherry picked from the study.

    You guys really believe something without double checking the source and yet claim not to be sheep.

    Also, it's not peer reviewed:

    medRxiv publishes preliminary scientific reports that are not peer-reviewed and, therefore, should not be regarded as conclusive, guide clinical practice/health-related behavior, or treated as established information.
    Last edited by Capgros on 10:31:41 - 06/09/21
  • Viva Tyrion [1967379]Tyrion [1967379]
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    Posted on 10:36:33 - 06/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Tyrion [1967379]

    Oh gawd the politics involved even...

    So glad to stay unvaccinated, goodluck with your 10th+ booster shot soon, or daily pills from Pfizer lmao

    No adverse reactions here :)

    My body, my choice.

    -El- [463504]

    I seriously hope you catch it.

    Tyrion [1967379]

    Maybe I have already, I've had a cold or 2 in the last few years...

    Recent Harvard study suggests I have more protection from Covid then through my natural immune system :)

    Imagine that eh, no shots or boosters needed even!

    -El- [463504]

    Maybe I have already

    Doubtful, and even if you did you wouldn't post about it.

    I have no issue watching Darwinism at work.
    Meh, why doubtful if there's a scary "pandemic" ongoing and people are supposedly infected daily?

    Reminds me of another question unanswered by the media btw, how many of these socalled positive test cases are unsympthomatic people and how many of those cases have actually been clinically examined as well, to confirm an actual infection?

    I've been looking for these numbers but can't find it.

    I do have lots examples from people I know though, but I guess that's just hearsay.

    Medical practicioners that demand a covid test before you're allowed to visit them, when it turns out positive, you're being diagnosed as another Covid patient, without any doctors actually having seen nor checked you etc...

    I'm open to any official research documents, reviewing those positive cases based on tests versus the actually clinically sick.

    Feel free point me towards any.
  •   Bhappychap [2270497]Bhappychap [2270497]
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    Posted on 10:43:05 - 06/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Tyrion [1967379]

    Oh gawd the politics involved even...

    So glad to stay unvaccinated, goodluck with your 10th+ booster shot soon, or daily pills from Pfizer lmao

    No adverse reactions here :)

    My body, my choice.

    -El- [463504]

    I seriously hope you catch it.

    Tyrion [1967379]

    Maybe I have already, I've had a cold or 2 in the last few years...

    Recent Harvard study suggests I have more protection from Covid then through my natural immune system :)

    Imagine that eh, no shots or boosters needed even!

    Capgros [2088627]

    I don't think the author of the article read the study properly, or he deliberately cherry picked from the study.

    You guys really believe something without double checking the source and yet claim not to be sheep.

    Also, it's not peer reviewed:

    medRxiv publishes preliminary scientific reports that are not peer-reviewed and, therefore, should not be regarded as conclusive, guide clinical practice/health-related behavior, or treated as established information.
    And the fact most travel conditions allow a "previous proven covid infection" as an OK to travel. 

    Guessing this person didn't get it, doesn't have proof they did. And is randomly linking weird ass websites with cherry picked information based on their bias.

    I mean Kulldork, the guy from the article, isn't even listed on the study, and neither the study or researchers were put on by harvard...
  • Viva Tyrion [1967379]Tyrion [1967379]
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    Posted on 11:02:05 - 06/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Another quite simple question that needs to be answered still, how many people in hospitals actually died from Covid and were they committed for Covid or other reasons in the first place, then tested "positive" afterwards to up the numbers and scarefactor?

    What happened to the flu numbers, these past 2 years?

    Why do governments ban certain events for the amount of total people, yet others are allowed?

    Why are there still mask mandates, when it's proven they can't stop ANY virus spread?

    If you stop watching any TV, reading any newspaper or whatever media and simply look around your own neighbourhoods, there's nothing special going on, no mass deaths or anything scary, yet all kinds of totalitarian laws are being passed now on the premise of the entire world being at risk, of what exactly?

    Keep your imposed fear please, this silly theater has gone on too much already.

    Time to get back to normal again and actually live.

    Next crisis will be orchestrated anyways again, the climate scare and we'll probably have a food scarcity + another financial crisis down the pipeline...

    Take your pick :p
  • NS Capgros [2088627]Capgros [2088627]
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    Posted on 11:04:46 - 06/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Tyrion [1967379]

    Another quite simple question that needs to be answered still, how many people in hospitals actually died from Covid and were they committed for Covid or other reasons in the first place, then tested "positive" afterwards to up the numbers and scarefactor?

    What happened to the flu numbers, these past 2 years?

    Why do governments ban certain events for the amount of total people, yet others are allowed?

    Why are there still mask mandates, when it's proven they can't stop ANY virus spread?

    If you stop watching any TV, reading any newspaper or whatever media and simply look around your own neighbourhoods, there's nothing special going on, no mass deaths or anything scary, yet all kinds of totalitarian laws are being passed now on the premise of the entire world being at risk, of what exactly?

    Keep your imposed fear please, this silly theater has gone on too much already.

    Time to get back to normal again and actually live.

    Next crisis will be orchestrated anyways again, the climate scare and we'll probably have a food scarcity + another financial crisis down the pipeline...

    Take your pick :p
    Why are all your questions biased, and contain wrong information?

    Keep your ignorance of fear please, this silly fearmongering has gone on too much already.
  • Viva Tyrion [1967379]Tyrion [1967379]
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    Posted on 11:07:01 - 06/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Tyrion [1967379]

    Another quite simple question that needs to be answered still, how many people in hospitals actually died from Covid and were they committed for Covid or other reasons in the first place, then tested "positive" afterwards to up the numbers and scarefactor?

    What happened to the flu numbers, these past 2 years?

    Why do governments ban certain events for the amount of total people, yet others are allowed?

    Why are there still mask mandates, when it's proven they can't stop ANY virus spread?

    If you stop watching any TV, reading any newspaper or whatever media and simply look around your own neighbourhoods, there's nothing special going on, no mass deaths or anything scary, yet all kinds of totalitarian laws are being passed now on the premise of the entire world being at risk, of what exactly?

    Keep your imposed fear please, this silly theater has gone on too much already.

    Time to get back to normal again and actually live.

    Next crisis will be orchestrated anyways again, the climate scare and we'll probably have a food scarcity + another financial crisis down the pipeline...

    Take your pick :p

    Capgros [2088627]

    Why are all your questions biased, and contain wrong information?

    Keep your ignorance of fear please, this silly fearmongering has gone on too much already.
    Exactly my point, thanks for the confirmation and let's get on with our lives again now.
  • NS Capgros [2088627]Capgros [2088627]
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    Posted on 11:08:46 - 06/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Tyrion [1967379]

    Another quite simple question that needs to be answered still, how many people in hospitals actually died from Covid and were they committed for Covid or other reasons in the first place, then tested "positive" afterwards to up the numbers and scarefactor?

    What happened to the flu numbers, these past 2 years?

    Why do governments ban certain events for the amount of total people, yet others are allowed?

    Why are there still mask mandates, when it's proven they can't stop ANY virus spread?

    If you stop watching any TV, reading any newspaper or whatever media and simply look around your own neighbourhoods, there's nothing special going on, no mass deaths or anything scary, yet all kinds of totalitarian laws are being passed now on the premise of the entire world being at risk, of what exactly?

    Keep your imposed fear please, this silly theater has gone on too much already.

    Time to get back to normal again and actually live.

    Next crisis will be orchestrated anyways again, the climate scare and we'll probably have a food scarcity + another financial crisis down the pipeline...

    Take your pick :p

    Capgros [2088627]

    Why are all your questions biased, and contain wrong information?

    Keep your ignorance of fear please, this silly fearmongering has gone on too much already.

    Tyrion [1967379]

    Exactly my point, thanks for the confirmation and let's get on with our lives again now.
    You are paranoid, and fail to see it, you can seek professional help for this, but it seems you are not really willing because of your fear of the medical community.
  • Viva Tyrion [1967379]Tyrion [1967379]
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    Posted on 11:13:05 - 06/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Tyrion [1967379]

    Another quite simple question that needs to be answered still, how many people in hospitals actually died from Covid and were they committed for Covid or other reasons in the first place, then tested "positive" afterwards to up the numbers and scarefactor?

    What happened to the flu numbers, these past 2 years?

    Why do governments ban certain events for the amount of total people, yet others are allowed?

    Why are there still mask mandates, when it's proven they can't stop ANY virus spread?

    If you stop watching any TV, reading any newspaper or whatever media and simply look around your own neighbourhoods, there's nothing special going on, no mass deaths or anything scary, yet all kinds of totalitarian laws are being passed now on the premise of the entire world being at risk, of what exactly?

    Keep your imposed fear please, this silly theater has gone on too much already.

    Time to get back to normal again and actually live.

    Next crisis will be orchestrated anyways again, the climate scare and we'll probably have a food scarcity + another financial crisis down the pipeline...

    Take your pick :p

    Capgros [2088627]

    Why are all your questions biased, and contain wrong information?

    Keep your ignorance of fear please, this silly fearmongering has gone on too much already.

    Tyrion [1967379]

    Exactly my point, thanks for the confirmation and let's get on with our lives again now.

    Capgros [2088627]

    You are paranoid, and fail to see it, you can seek professional help for this, but it seems you are not really willing because of your fear of the medical community.
    I'm not in any fear of Covid, hence I don't need any vaccinations, nor booster shots nor pills.

    I actually trust my own immune system, who are you to judge that?
  • NS Capgros [2088627]Capgros [2088627]
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    Posted on 11:20:07 - 06/09/21 (1 month ago)
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    Tyrion [1967379]

    Another quite simple question that needs to be answered still, how many people in hospitals actually died from Covid and were they committed for Covid or other reasons in the first place, then tested "positive" afterwards to up the numbers and scarefactor?

    What happened to the flu numbers, these past 2 years?

    Why do governments ban certain events for the amount of total people, yet others are allowed?

    Why are there still mask mandates, when it's proven they can't stop ANY virus spread?

    If you stop watching any TV, reading any newspaper or whatever media and simply look around your own neighbourhoods, there's nothing special going on, no mass deaths or anything scary, yet all kinds of totalitarian laws are being passed now on the premise of the entire world being at risk, of what exactly?

    Keep your imposed fear please, this silly theater has gone on too much already.

    Time to get back to normal again and actually live.

    Next crisis will be orchestrated anyways again, the climate scare and we'll probably have a food scarcity + another financial crisis down the pipeline...

    Take your pick :p

    Capgros [2088627]

    Why are all your questions biased, and contain wrong information?

    Keep your ignorance of fear please, this silly fearmongering has gone on too much already.

    Tyrion [1967379]

    Exactly my point, thanks for the confirmation and let's get on with our lives again now.

    Capgros [2088627]

    You are paranoid, and fail to see it, you can seek professional help for this, but it seems you are not really willing because of your fear of the medical community.

    Tyrion [1967379]

    I'm not in any fear of Covid, hence I don't need any vaccinations, nor booster shots nor pills.

    I actually trust my own immune system, who are you to judge that?
    Billions of people did the same I guess when diseases like the black death and polio roamed the earth, your immune system can just simply not handle everything, as history has proved thousands of times. But believe the crap you want to believe, you are free to be as dumb as you want, nobody is stopping you although you claim different.
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