Estimating stat range by rank | Tutorials & Guides | TORN

Estimating stat range by rank

​

    • Josephine [1923258]
    • Role: Wiki Contributor
    • Level: 20
    • Posts: 3,377
    • Karma: 12,769
    • Last Action: 7 minutes
      • 1
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Thread created on 03:37:45 - 18/10/18 (8 years ago)
    |
    Last replied 08:55:15 - 22/08/22 (4 years ago)
    So, on several occasions I've found myself explaining to noobs how stats are rank triggers and that you can guess someone's stat range just by looking at their rank and visible triggers. I checked to see if there was any direction I could send them in for further reading, but all I could find were the normal rank guide, which is mostly just explaining triggers, and a target-finding guide that mentioned the possibility, but did not explain the process in detail.

    Therefore, that's what I'm going to do, explain the process of guessing stats by rank and show some examples. It can work on anyone, but only provides a range if the person is below 250m total. When it comes to battle stat rank triggers, we will be using the high-end of them to make our estimates. For example, if the person has the 2k-2.5k trigger, we will be assuming the minimum to be the highest option, 2,500.

    So basically this is intended to help new players, as its usefulness is minimal for stronger players.

    To start, get the shortcomings of this out of the way.

    a) If a person has unbalanced stats, the triggering of a rank can be delayed. It's generally stated that more balanced people will have their rank trigger faster, but there's no clear guideline for specific different unbalanced builds.

    b) You cannot drop in rank, but you can lose networth triggers (which have to be held for 7 days to be gained in the first place). For example, if you get a rank up from 5b networth but drop below 5b networth, that becomes a so-called "ghost trigger". You cannot rank up unless you regain or replace that trigger. For example, if someone reaches Elite rank with 50b networth at level 99, drops in networth, then levels up to 100, they cannot become Invincible because they are now missing the 50b networth trigger.

    Although I will explain everything here, for reference, you can use the wiki page for rank. Clicky.

    There are four categories of rank triggers - levels, crimes, networth, and battle stats. Reaching each of these adds +1 to your rank. You cannot level down or reduce crimes, so those cannot be lost. Networth can drop, however, so those are the ones that can most typically become ghost triggers. In theory you can drop below a stat trigger if your stats are really low and you have Speed/PCP overdoses but... let's not go down that rabbit hole.

    There are a grand total of 26 ranks, and everyone starts at rank 1, so there are 25 ranks you can gain. 

    Obviously, to calculate the amount of stats triggers, you need to know the level, total crimes, and networth of your targets. The level is visible on the profile without any action needed, but you need to actively check the other two.

    To do this, you can click the option to view personal stats on the person's profile.



    And check the total criminal offences and networth on the stats, either by scrolling down or by clicking the respective icons to quickly reach them (in this picture, crimes are circled red and other, where networth is located, is circled blue).



    Alternatively, you can use a script that shows the personal stats right there on their profile, such as Torn Stats or another. Such scripts typically allow you to select which stats are shown, so if you're attempting to guess stats by rank, you can just make it show you their criminal offences and networth.



    There are several ways in which you can calculate stat range based off rank - you can manually count down the ranks, crossing off every rank they have, or just calculate it mathematically.

    Let's begin with our first example, using both methods. (Volunteer's stat total is about - 600,000,000+)



    To manually count the ranks, you have to mark out one trigger that they have for every rank they have (ignoring Absolute beginner as that involves no triggers).

    If you need a guideline, look at the table as shown on the wiki.



    Let's start from the top, on level triggers, and at Beginner. Does the person have that trigger? If so, cross it out and move horizontally to the next within the category, then repeat the process until you find a trigger they don't have, or are out of triggers. Once that happens, move down to the next category. For each rank they do have, cross out a trigger.

    windy, our volunteer who may or may not be a noob, has Idolised rank at level 69. This means he has the ranks from Beginner to Idolised (as I said, Absolute beginner is the start and it's irrelevant).

    Let's begin. Cross out level 2 for Beginner. Cross out level 6 for Inexperienced. Cross out level 11 for Rookie. Cross out level 26 for Novice. Cross out level 31 for Below average. Cross out level 50 for Average. He is below level 71, so there are no more rank triggers to be found here. Move down to crime triggers next. 

    Cross out 100 crimes for Reasonable. Cross out 5k crimes for Above average. Cross out 10k for Competent. Cross out 20k for Highly competent. He has 21k crimes, so there are no more rank triggers to be found here. Move down to networth triggers next.

    Cross out 5m networth for Veteran. Cross out 50m networth for Distinguished. Cross out 500m networth for Highly distinguished. Cross out 5b networth for Professional. He has 5.9b networth, so there are no more rank triggers to be found here.

    We're done counting the public triggers, now we have to calculate the stat ones. We made it all the way to rank #15 Professional, and windy is rank #21 Idolised, which means there's 6 battle stats rank triggers. You can see where this is going.

    Cross out 2k-2.5k for Star. Cross out 20k-25k for Master. Cross out 200k-250k for Outstanding. Cross out 2m-2.5m for Celebrity. Cross out 20m-35m for Supreme. Cross out 200m-250m for Idolised.

    So in the end, you have something like this:



    Obviously a bit rudimentary, but it helps you count it all down. 

    Now, let's try to do this mathematically. If he has Idolised rank, he has 20 rank triggers.

    Level 69 gives him 6 level triggers.

    21k crimes give him 4 crime triggers.

    5.9b networth gives him 4 networth triggers.

    That leads up to:

    20-6=14 (subtract 6 level triggers)

    14-4=10 (subtract 4 crime triggers)

    10-4=6 (subtract 4 networth triggers)

    That means, as above, that he has 6 battle stats rank triggers, which leads up to 250m+ total stats.

    As a guideline, based off the amount of battle stats rank triggers once you have calculated it, you can estimate:

     
    Amount of battle stat triggersEstimated stat range
    0Less than 2,500
    12,500 to 25,000
    225,000 to 250,000
    3250,000 to 2,500,000
    42,500,000 to 35,000,000
    535,000,000 to 250,000,000
    6250,000,000 or higher

     

    Note: remember that given the inaccurate nature of rank triggers on unbalanced people, these ranges remain estimates, so it's possible for someone to be slightly below or above the range if greatly unbalanced.

    With all that spelled out, let's look at some more examples in quick succession. We already have windy as example of 250m+ so let's look into the other ranges.

    An example of 35m-250m range, the one who originally asked me for an explanation on how to calculate this. (Stat total is around 41,000,000) 



     

    Total rank triggers=16

    Level triggers: 5
    Crime triggers: 2
    Networth: 4 

    16-5=11

    11-2=9

    9-4=5

    That leaves us at 5 battle stats rank triggers.

    5 battle stats rank triggers mean 35,000,000 to 250,000,000 stat range estimate.

    See?

    Volunteer example for 2.5m-35m range now. (Around - 3,000,000)





    Total rank triggers = 13

    Level triggers: 5
    Crime triggers: 1
    Networth triggers: 3

    13-5=8

    8-1=7

    7-3=4

    That leaves us at 4 battle stats rank triggers.

    4 battle stats rank triggers mean an estimate of 2,500,000 to 35,000,000 stats.

    Getting the point? Now let's see some more examples. Here's a volunteer on the 250k-2.5m range. (Volunteer's stat total is around - 1,000,000)





    Total rank triggers = 12

    Level triggers: 3
    Crime triggers: 2
    Networth triggers: 4

    12-3=9

    9-2=7

    7-4=3

    That means there's 3 battle stats rank triggers. 

    3 battle stats rank triggers mean 250,000 to 2,500,000 estimated stat range.

    Here's a volunteer on the 25k-250k stat range and oh gosh I can't believe I ended up looking for examples of almost all ranges.

    .



    Total rank triggers = 8

    Level triggers: 3
    Crime triggers: 1
    Networth triggers: 2

    8-3=5

    5-1=4

    4-2=2

    So 2 battle stats rank triggers.

    That means 25,000 to 250,000 stat range estimated.

    Told you I'd try to get an example of every range. :')

    Here's a volunteer example of, I don't know, let's find out. (Spoiler - around 17,000)





    Total rank triggers = 7

    Level triggers: 3
    Crime triggers: 1
    Networth triggers: 2



    7-3=4

    4-1=3

    3-2=1

    That leaves us at 1 battle stats rank. Or at the 2,500 to 25,000 total stats range.

    I could include more examples here, but I think everyone gets the point by now, so I'll just move on to a note on ghost triggers.

    As stated, ghost triggers are triggers you have lost, usually networth triggers. You can't rank down, but if you lose a trigger, you can't gain a new rank until you regain or replace the lost one.

    Here's a volunteer who ended up having a ghost trigger (total about - 6,000,000):





    Now, there's something wrong in here.

    To be Professional rank, he must have 14 rank triggers.

    Yet as you can see...

    Level triggers: 5
    Crime triggers: 2
    Networth triggers: 2

    14-5=9

    9-2=7

    7-2=5

    That would leave him at 5 battle stats rank triggers, or on the 35,000,000 to 250,000,000, but I know this is not the case, he is on the range of 2,500,000 to 35,000,000.

    I know this example might not be too clear, but it's decent enough. He had a rank trigger (500m networth) and he lost it. That causes his triggers to be out of place. He has a ghost trigger for that lost networth now, which makes it look like he must have another trigger elsewhere (battle stats) when looking at the raw numbers, but he does not.

    Basically, ghost triggers don't just prevent new rank-ups til they are handled, they mess up calculations. So if something doesn't look right, check the person's networth graph for any signs of them having previously had a higher rank trigger before drawing certain conclusions on your calculations.



    Now, now... I hope this helped you figure out how the calculations work?

    In any case, I have this thing, which I left for the end because otherwise people probably wouldn't have read all the above.

    This calculator is designed to determine the stat range based off the numbers you provide. It was made on an excel sheet then turned into a google sheet, so if there's any errors with the google sheet version, please inform me and I'll try to fix it ASAP.

    Going to include one last volunteer to show you how the calculator works (total about 15,000,000).



    Here's how it goes:



    So..... That is all, I guess.  I hope this helps some noobs!
     
    • Torntheheckup [2151933]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 22
    • Posts: 165
    • Karma: 23
    • Last Action: 1 year
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 03:41:36 - 18/10/18 (8 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link
    Awesome
    • Maharet [1563099]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 99
    • Posts: 65
    • Karma: 49
    • Last Action: 6 hours
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 05:29:30 - 18/10/18 (8 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link
    Very well written Jose! Thank you for the info, it has increased that area of my gameplay more than you could ever know!
    • windy [2039424]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 100
    • Posts: 210
    • Karma: 1,058
    • Last Action: 27 days
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 06:00:16 - 18/10/18 (8 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link
    Absolutely amazing!

    34cb3c01fea52c5e404440323b98314c.gif

    • Wiber [2065939]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 100
    • Posts: 3,502
    • Karma: 4,051
    • Last Action: 1 hour
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 07:31:39 - 18/10/18 (8 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link
    Great work!

    • Riot [974353]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 100
    • Posts: 9,016
    • Karma: 18,698
    • Last Action: 5 days
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 07:56:45 - 18/10/18 (8 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link
    Oh damn I knew it could be done but never really bothered with the effort, that calculator will make it much easier, great guide I'll be sharing with some of the lowbies in my faction :)

    R+
    • The-Fury [2097454]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 100
    • Posts: 798
    • Karma: 1,686
    • Last Action: 2 years
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 13:27:26 - 18/10/18 (8 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link
    This is fantastic! Very helpful, not just for very new noobs but for everyone! So much effort went into the creation of this guide and at definitely paid off. 

    Definitely R+
    • Gucci [2089397]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 92
    • Posts: 172
    • Karma: 157
    • Last Action: 3 days
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 23:44:05 - 20/10/18 (8 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link
    R+

    • Hemorrhoid [1969864]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 90
    • Posts: 1,254
    • Karma: 1,325
    • Last Action: 1 year
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 06:58:54 - 22/10/18 (8 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link
    Ive used rank triggers to determine my attacks for a long time. Good to see a nice guide on it, you explain it much better than i can.

    R+ 

    • Michi [1922819]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 100
    • Posts: 2,950
    • Karma: 4,628
    • Last Action: 2 hours
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 02:03:50 - 23/10/18 (8 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link
    I actually explained this a little in my picking targets guide, I might link this for more detailed explanation :) 

    8982c67c-68e0-4b28-9d47-cd15eb500dd3-1922819.gif

    • Ptilopsis [2001645]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 40
    • Posts: 382
    • Karma: 176
    • Last Action: 1 year
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 04:02:54 - 23/10/18 (8 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link
    Sweet!

    • nepherius [2009878]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 15
    • Posts: 232
    • Karma: 333
    • Last Action: 22 hours
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 12:22:58 - 09/11/18 (7 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link
    Great job with this, I made an extension based on it. Not gonna link here but it can be found in the appropriate section of the forums. Awesome job!
    Last edited by nepherius on 12:24:10 - 09/11/18 (7 years ago)

    Torn.Market - Get your own self-price updating website

    My other scripts: Script List

    Accepting script requests, usually free, if I find them interesting.

    • Josephine [1923258]
    • Role: Wiki Contributor
    • Level: 20
    • Posts: 3,377
    • Karma: 12,769
    • Last Action: 7 minutes
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 03:06:27 - 08/12/18 (7 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link
    Fixed the issue with the sheet not being editable, why did no one tell me earlier, I didn't know it'd somehow locked :"/
     
    • Riot [974353]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 100
    • Posts: 9,016
    • Karma: 18,698
    • Last Action: 5 days
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 09:45:24 - 11/12/18 (7 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link
    So apparently this guy has over 250m battlestats, yet my friends can beat him wth less than 1m total, can anyone explain?

    https://www.torn.com/profiles.php?XID=1318346#/
    Last edited by Riot on 09:45:44 - 11/12/18 (7 years ago)
    • RYAN_SHEPHERD [2038695]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 100
    • Posts: 10,645
    • Karma: 3,122
    • Last Action: 2 minutes
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 10:57:50 - 11/12/18 (7 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link

    Riot [974353]

    So apparently this guy has over 250m battlestats, yet my friends can beat him wth less than 1m total, can anyone explain? [url=https://www.torn.com/profiles.php?XID=1318346#/]https://www.torn.com/profiles.php?XID=1318346#/[/url]
    Most likely he's imbalanced. 
    • Riot [974353]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 100
    • Posts: 9,016
    • Karma: 18,698
    • Last Action: 5 days
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 11:01:44 - 11/12/18 (7 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link

    Riot [974353]

    So apparently this guy has over 250m battlestats, yet my friends can beat him wth less than 1m total, can anyone explain? [url=https://www.torn.com/profiles.php?XID=1318346#/]https://www.torn.com/profiles.php?XID=1318346#/[/url]

    RYAN_SHEPHERD [2038695]

    Most likely he's imbalanced. 
    I'm gonna pay for a spy because the only stat that I could think of is speed? otherwise he would have won / stalemated with a single one of the other stats above 250m
    • Josephine [1923258]
    • Role: Wiki Contributor
    • Level: 20
    • Posts: 3,377
    • Karma: 12,769
    • Last Action: 7 minutes
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 11:31:35 - 11/12/18 (7 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link

    Riot [974353]

    So apparently this guy has over 250m battlestats, yet my friends can beat him wth less than 1m total, can anyone explain? [url=https://www.torn.com/profiles.php?XID=1318346#/]https://www.torn.com/profiles.php?XID=1318346#/[/url]

    RYAN_SHEPHERD [2038695]

    Most likely he's imbalanced. 

    Riot [974353]

    I'm gonna pay for a spy because the only stat that I could think of is speed? otherwise he would have won / stalemated with a single one of the other stats above 250m
    With the Deserter rank, he gained the rank under the previous system tbh. I myself used to have Distinguished rank but couldn't rank up when the system changed because it worked differently then. The guy you linked has been inactive since way before rank triggers even changed.

    xxxxx: Money on hand: $0 Strength: 135,853 Speed: 25,215 Dexterity: 17,856 Defense: N/A Total: 230,180

     
     
    • Riot [974353]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 100
    • Posts: 9,016
    • Karma: 18,698
    • Last Action: 5 days
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 11:40:05 - 11/12/18 (7 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link

    Riot [974353]

    So apparently this guy has over 250m battlestats, yet my friends can beat him wth less than 1m total, can anyone explain? [url=https://www.torn.com/profiles.php?XID=1318346#/]https://www.torn.com/profiles.php?XID=1318346#/[/url]

    RYAN_SHEPHERD [2038695]

    Most likely he's imbalanced. 

    Riot [974353]

    I'm gonna pay for a spy because the only stat that I could think of is speed? otherwise he would have won / stalemated with a single one of the other stats above 250m

    Josephine [1923258]

    With the Deserter rank, he gained the rank under the previous system tbh. I myself used to have Distinguished rank but couldn't rank up when the system changed because it worked differently then. The guy you linked has been inactive since way before rank triggers even changed. xxxxx:[url=https://www.torn.com/profiles.php?XID=486395] [/url]Money on hand: $0 Strength: 135,853 Speed: 25,215 Dexterity: 17,856 Defense: N/A Total: 230,180  
    I didn't realise there was such a drastic change in them though, thanks for that! 
    • Josephine [1923258]
    • Role: Wiki Contributor
    • Level: 20
    • Posts: 3,377
    • Karma: 12,769
    • Last Action: 7 minutes
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 17:36:49 - 11/12/18 (7 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link

    Riot [974353]

    So apparently this guy has over 250m battlestats, yet my friends can beat him wth less than 1m total, can anyone explain? [url=https://www.torn.com/profiles.php?XID=1318346#/]https://www.torn.com/profiles.php?XID=1318346#/[/url]

    RYAN_SHEPHERD [2038695]

    Most likely he's imbalanced. 

    Riot [974353]

    I'm gonna pay for a spy because the only stat that I could think of is speed? otherwise he would have won / stalemated with a single one of the other stats above 250m

    Josephine [1923258]

    With the Deserter rank, he gained the rank under the previous system tbh. I myself used to have Distinguished rank but couldn't rank up when the system changed because it worked differently then. The guy you linked has been inactive since way before rank triggers even changed. xxxxx:[url=https://www.torn.com/profiles.php?XID=486395] [/url]Money on hand: $0 Strength: 135,853 Speed: 25,215 Dexterity: 17,856 Defense: N/A Total: 230,180  

    Riot [974353]

    I didn't realise there was such a drastic change in them though, thanks for that! 
    Rank triggers in the case of long-time inactives used to be way iffier, but those who were missing ranks got ranked up in their absent at some point. But you can't lose ranks. On the old system you pretty much had to actively work on ranking up, and stats didn't matter. Inactives who were below their would-be rank on the new system were forcefully ranked up, but those who achieved a higher rank on the old system are harder to pinpoint. Active players who have too many rank triggers from the old system couldn't rank up until they made up for it in the new system, which would also be noticeable in the case of those Deserters since they'd be incapable of ranking up, they're "over-ranked", so to speak, but since they're inactive, it rarely becomes relevant since there's not much attention to them.

    An example of inactives differing in rank between systems would be leadz. He had Veteran rank on the old system but was forcefully ranked up to Star (because of stats). Since he is an inactive, you can notice his rank was changed after the changes in the system. How? Because his rank might have been bumped to Star, but his medals remain the same as he earned on the old system.

     
    • Manly [1913794]
    • Role: Civilian
    • Level: 100
    • Posts: 1,224
    • Karma: 1,763
    • Last Action: 3 hours
      • 0
    • Reason:
      Are you sure you want to report this post to staff?
      Cancel
    Posted on 05:25:31 - 15/01/19 (7 years ago)
    Post link copied to clipboard Copy post link
    If they have more awards than you and more days played, it's not worth it. 

    If they have more days played and less awards than you, it's worth it.

    -The Mobile Strat

    oKJaAve.gif

Reply
Thread Title: