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CoolHandLuke
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Posted on Thu Nov 22, 2012 01:29:33
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By bosox [278767]
To me, they are not the same things, Luke. But I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this (as with the rest of the league agrees with me as well  ) Anyways predictions for the American Tradition |
actually the league agrees with me that running the score is just poor sportsmanship, and running your defense 100% of the time is poor sportsmenship. Only difference is, running the score is expected from pats, running your D 100% isnt expected at all, so it came as a shock which caused more of an uproar then it would if they did it lets say, every time they get a chance. If they did that for about a year or so players would complain and coaches would just carry on the way they do with running the score up.
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_TheCrow_
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Posted on Thu Nov 22, 2012 01:35:17
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By MachineGunSteve [184119]
By bosox [278767]
Patriots are playing as well |
Yeah, I just found that out... is this a new thing, lol. I swear there were only two games on Turkey Day, lol.
New England should kill the Jets, but I won't make a prediction as to the exact score... NE by at least 9 points. |
Nah, just the regular Thursday night game these days, just happens to be the one on Turkey day. Pretty sure there were 3 last year as well.
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bosox
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Posted on Thu Nov 22, 2012 23:01:26
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Luke, if you want to call it "poor sportsmanship," then that's fine. It's not ultra classy when the Pats roll the offense out there every down in a blowout. But it's not dirty. A dirty play is something that either has no benefit or is questionable to the offending team and and has a high chance (if not intentional purpose) to injure someone on the opposing team.
But actually, the 3rd Thanksgiving game has happened for I think 2 or 3 years in a row now. I'm not sure if it's just Thursday Night Football (which i tmight not be, since there was no every week TNF last year, but there was still 3 Turkey Day games), but it is becoming a tradition to have 3 games. It's just not the same 3rd home team every year, like with Dallas and Detroit.
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-El-
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Posted on Fri Nov 23, 2012 13:23:51
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Cowboys did pretty well yesterday.
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bosox
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Posted on Fri Nov 23, 2012 16:08:11
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This again sums up Romo's career. He threw for 441 yards an d people will say the defense let him down and he scored 31 points but still lost... Bg it will gt overlooked and ignored that he looked terrible in the beginning of the game and threw, what was it, 2 or 3 picks before digging himself a 3 score hole to climb out of, which proved to be too much. Same old romo, and I wonder when Luke and Crow will start seeing that he is not the right man for this job now, 7 years into this.
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CoolHandLuke
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Posted on Fri Nov 23, 2012 19:36:16
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well, dallas didnt do ANYTHING i EXPECTED.....
and for bosox, i have never said romo was the qb for dallas. I have said he is the best we got, and he is a good qb.....but you can keep having conversations with-in your own mind with somebody named Luke.
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bosox
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Posted on Fri Nov 23, 2012 20:29:09
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No, you like to defend romo against most criticism and have blamed many of the losses and bad seasons and lack of playoff success on the defense. And of course he's the best you guys have...typically the starting QB on a team is the best they have. The Cowboys have just been unwilling to accept Romo isn't he man for the job and really haven't done anyhing to try and replace him.
But the Cowboys did exactly what the rest of the country expected: a big home game on national TV against a divisional opponent with a chance to put some serious pressure on the Giants... And you guys, as usual, came out flat, romo throwing picks, defense struggling, poor play calling, and went down 28-3 before you realized it and everyone knew the game was over from there, and it was not even as close as the final 7 point deficit looked to be. Typical Dallas and romo over the past years
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SpazzyMcgee
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Posted on Fri Nov 23, 2012 21:19:50
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By -El- [463504]
Cowboys did pretty well yesterday. |
Lol
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bosox
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Posted on Fri Nov 23, 2012 22:22:53
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By SpazzyMcgee [1519781]
By -El- [463504]
Cowboys did pretty well yesterday. |
Lol |
Almost as good as the Colts did their last game
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_TheCrow_
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Posted on Sat Nov 24, 2012 01:40:29
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Terrible season or not, terrible game or not, I still think Romo is a top 10 QB with a line that wouldn't protect a QB in a high school game with a coach that couldn't gameplan how to close a ZipLoc baggy. We can agree to disagree, I know everyone thinks he's terrible but to each their own.... not gonna get that debate going again for the next few pages...
All I can do is hope and pray that Jerry's dumb ass sticks to his word for a change and tries to help our oline this offseason, and maybe pick up a running back that can stay healthy. And we need a new training and conditioning staff ffs. I don't think I've seen any other team in the league have so many calf, hamstring and groin problems in my entire life.
A new coach, a better Oline and a healthy RB could do wonders for this team in my opinion.
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SpazzyMcgee
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Posted on Sat Nov 24, 2012 02:05:04
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By bosox [278767]
By SpazzyMcgee [1519781]
By -El- [463504]
Cowboys did pretty well yesterday. |
Lol |
Almost as good as the Colts did their last game |
Fair point... the only person on the Indianapolis side of the ball that played pretty well, I thought, was T.Y. Hilton
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bosox
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Posted on Sat Nov 24, 2012 03:42:01
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My top 15 QBs in the league right now:
1 - Tom Brady
2 - Drew Brees
3 - Aaron Rodgers
4 - Peyton Manning
5 - Robert Griffin III
6 - Matt Schuabb
7 - Matt Ryan
8 - Andrew Luck
9 - Eli Manning
10 - Mathew Stafford
11 - Josh Freeman
12 - Andy Dalton
13 - Tony Romo
14 - Joey Flacco
15 - Ben Roethlisberger
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SpazzyMcgee
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Posted on Sat Nov 24, 2012 04:22:44
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I agree with the list pretty much, except I think Roethlisberger should be a little higher
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bosox
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Posted on Sat Nov 24, 2012 05:22:26
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Ehh Roethlisberger really isn't that great. His stats are normally pretty average, and in his ONLY season where he started a full 16 games, he only put up 3,300 YD, 17 TD and 15 INT. Other than that, he's either injured or not blowing anyone away with anything. If you put him on a team with an average or poor defense, he would never have won anything. He is the Terry Bradshaw of this generation, and I guess it's no surprise Bradshaw was also a Steeler and a multiple (4 time) Super Bowl champion. Pittsburgh just doesn't win games with their QBs, they do it with defense. He also has kind of sucked in some playoff games, including his first Super Bowl win against Seatte, where he threw for 123 YD 0 TD and 2 INT for a 22 rating. His TD/INT ratio in his 3 Super Bowls is 3/5... and sorry but if the Patriots get slack for "only" winning their SBs by 3 points each, getting to play Matt Hasselback in 2005 and the 8-8 Cardinals in 2008... I am simply not impressed by those two wins. Maybe back when Warner was with the Rams on the Greatest Show on Turf back in 2001, when the Patriots beat him, that meant something to beat him in a SB... but in 2008? Ehh...
Roethlisberger isn't great, and it became clear Pittsburgh can be tough without him, as Baltimore barely beat them with Leftwhich in.
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_TheCrow_
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Posted on Sun Nov 25, 2012 02:19:15
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By bosox [278767]
My top 15 QBs in the league right now:
1 - Tom Brady
2 - Drew Brees
3 - Aaron Rodgers
4 - Peyton Manning
5 - Robert Griffin III
6 - Matt Schuabb
7 - Matt Ryan
8 - Andrew Luck
9 - Eli Manning
10 - Mathew Stafford
11 - Josh Freeman
12 - Andy Dalton
13 - Tony Romo
14 - Joey Flacco
15 - Ben Roethlisberger |
As with any list, it's all debatable. Personally I would never put rookies on a top anything list, they need a few years of proving to me. Look at "Superman". Many would have called him top 5 after last year and now he looks bad-below average.
Imho
1. Aaron Rodgers
2. Drew Brees
3. Tom Brady
4. Peyton Manning
5. Matt Ryan
6. Ben Roethlisberger
7. Mathew Stafford
From here on its just too close to call. Eli, Romo, Rivers and Flacco are all inconsistent and I'm not even sure why you added Freeman up there. And you can't simply say Eli is better because of the rings when you just said rings didn't matter for Ben. Regardless, if I just added the remainder of those names to my list in your order, that would still put Romo at 9. Still a top 10 in my opinion, like I said. I know no one in here agrees with me but thats the beauty of opinions.
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bosox
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Posted on Sun Nov 25, 2012 17:38:27
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Well I'm doing a list of right now, this year, not past 5 years or best career. I put Freeman up there because he's 6-4 with 2,500 yards, 21 TDs and 7 INTs. And I put Eli in the top 10 because he's still not having a "bad" year, and I do factor in experience. Whereas someone like Roethlisberger is playing pretty much how he has always played; average and injured. Eli also doesn't have the benefit of the Pittsburgh defense, and is having to win games with his arm, like he did last season, whereas Roethlisberger has always been able to fall back on the fact his D is always outstanding.
As for not putting rookies up there, I see no point in that. Like I said, this isn't a list of who is going to have a better career or who has had a better career, it's just a list of who's hot right now. And I don't see any reason to think Roethlisberger is having a better year than Griffin.
The only thing I'd really argue with your list is putting Rodgers as 1. He's really not having that great of a season. If you want to put Brees as 1 I wouldn't argue that, though, of course, I think Brady is topping the charts this season. But Rodgers isn't having a great season, in comparison to other QBs, and I think most of the hype around him is coming from his performance last year. But really, he has only passed for 2,600 yards, he's got 27 TDs and 6 INts, which are both excellent, but Brees has 28 and Brady only has 3 INTs, and both have far more yards.
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_TheCrow_
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Posted on Sun Nov 25, 2012 22:18:43
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The main reason I have Rodgers and Bree's above of Brady is because their teams run game is non existent and they are truly carrying their teams. Unlike many previous years, Brady has a great run game helping him out now. For some people that may not factor in to judging a QB but IMO it should. Deep down I've always thought Manning was overrated because of the talent around him and having a running game, same with alot of other QB's. I've even said Aikman was WAYYYY overrated because the run game and online made that team. Joey Harrington, Ryan Leaf or Jamarcus Russell could have won atleast 1 or 2 Super Bowls with those teams in the 90's.
Anyway, on my cell so don't feel like going into to everything just yet.
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bosox
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Posted on Sun Nov 25, 2012 23:33:33
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Well this is where the hard to evaluate "pure passer" topic comes in. I've always said I think Brees is the purest passer in the league. Putting aside clutch performances and interceptions, Brees throws the ball a lot, completes a very high percentage of his passes and puts up 4,500 YD and 35 TD in his sleep. But he throws picks--lots of them. So if I need someone to air the ball out 40 yards down field on a must have pass, I'd take Brees. But if I wanted someone to win games, put up stats, make few or no mistakes and carry a team through the playoffs, I'm still picking Brady. Brady is a very efficient QB, as he's averaging 35 TD to 8 INTs his past 5 years up to this current week. Whereas Brees is averaging 35/15 over the same span.
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-El-
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Posted on Mon Nov 26, 2012 19:33:56
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By _TheCrow_ [686314]
you can't simply say Eli is better because of the rings when you just said rings didn't matter for Ben. Regardless, if I just added the remainder of those names to my list in your order, that would still put Romo at 9. |
What I specifically bolded in that quote...Bosox said that?
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bosox
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Posted on Mon Nov 26, 2012 23:05:41
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The rings only don't matter for two people in the NFL: Ben Roethlisberger and Terry Bradshaw. Between them they have 6 rings, Bradshaw being the only other person with as many as Montana... yet who ever talks about Bradshaw? They both also played for the Steelers; a team known for it's defense. And neither Roethlisberger or Bradshaw did anything great or out of the ordinary, and in fact Ben had an incredibly terrible Super Bowl against Seattle, had something like a 22 rating, and has thrown more picks than TDs in his 3 Super Bowl games he's played in. Bradshaw was kind of hit or miss in the Super Bowl, having one game where he only threw for 95 yards, and another where he threw 3 picks. Both of them won, and really that's all that matters when you really get down to it, so both of them will always be in the discussion of great QBs of their generation... but neither of them will ever be on the level that Montana and Brady are on.
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bosox
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Posted on Tue Nov 27, 2012 04:50:06
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Something interesting I just discovered... the Giants also had Montana's number as well haha. Montana is 2-3 against them in the playoffs, combining for 6 TD to 7 INT... far below his 4-0 record and his 11/0 TD/INT Super Bowl ratio...
...those damn pesky Giants.
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_TheCrow_
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Posted on Wed Nov 28, 2012 08:43:53
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By -El- [463504]
By _TheCrow_ [686314]
you can't simply say Eli is better because of the rings when you just said rings didn't matter for Ben. Regardless, if I just added the remainder of those names to my list in your order, that would still put Romo at 9. |
What I specifically bolded in that quote...Bosox said that? |
By bosox [278767]
The rings only don't matter for two people in the NFL |
Can you believe that? Championships EVER not mattering in Bosox opinion? And he actually said it twice now?!?!? lol.
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-El-
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Posted on Wed Nov 28, 2012 16:30:07
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By bosox [278767]
The rings only don't matter for two people in the NFL: Ben Roethlisberger and Terry Bradshaw. Between them they have 6 rings, Bradshaw being the only other person with as many as Montana... yet who ever talks about Bradshaw? They both also played for the Steelers; a team known for it's defense. And neither Roethlisberger or Bradshaw did anything great or out of the ordinary, and in fact Ben had an incredibly terrible Super Bowl against Seattle, had something like a 22 rating, and has thrown more picks than TDs in his 3 Super Bowl games he's played in. Bradshaw was kind of hit or miss in the Super Bowl, having one game where he only threw for 95 yards, and another where he threw 3 picks. Both of them won, and really that's all that matters when you really get down to it, so both of them will always be in the discussion of great QBs of their generation... but neither of them will ever be on the level that Montana and Brady are on. |
You're holding these two to a different standard than other QBs when I clearly saw you write before that rings matter. C'mon now.
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bosox
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Posted on Wed Nov 28, 2012 20:26:59
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Rings do matter, and that is the only reason why Roethlisberger and Bradshaw even get their names mentioned when talking about great QBs. But hey don't really matter much to them because if they had the same career with 1 or 0 rings, they wouldn't be remembered for anything. To be honest, I hear more hype around Warren Moon when talking about great QBs, than I do about Bradshaw. The simple fact the two of them are multiple time champions elevates them, but it doesn't elevate them higher than some of the other QBs who have won more. I think Brady, Montana and Warner were all better QBs than Roethlisberger and Bradshaw were/are. But I do think those two are both better than Elway. Now obviously if Montana hadn't won any or 1 ring, he'd be remembered differently, but was still a better QB and passer
I have no bias, grudges or reasons to like Warner more than Roethlisberger, as the Pats have beaten both in either a Super Bowl or AFC title game. Just as I have no personal preference to liking Montana more than Bradshaw.
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bosox
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Posted on Wed Nov 28, 2012 21:13:39
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Basically, I'll try to sum it up like this why the rings both matter above and, but the rings alone aren't going to turn you into a legend.
Dan Marino had to be throwing the ball for record breaking numbers in order for people to kind of begrudgingly now put him into elite QB company, because he never won a ring. He's remembered because of his stats, and look at the stats he had to put up to just get to the point he's at now.
Peyton Manning was considered the ultimate playoff choke artist, losing over 50% of his playoff runs in his first round, and was taunted for years by media and rivals for not being able to get it done, and despite his all-time great stats, there was never a consensus of whether or not he was even the best QB of his generation. Once he won, that changed everything.
Bradshaw/Roehtlisberger didn't ever have a crazy standout year where they were the most feared QB in football, but put up respectable stats and won multiple rings. They're remembered for being on Super Bowl winning teams more than for their stats.
Brady/Montana were two of the most feared players of their generations and all time. They put up stats, won games, and won multiple titles. They are remembered for their rings, stats and records.
No unfair or different standard for me. I call them how I see them and I love looking at the stats and context of it
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bosox
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Posted on Thu Nov 29, 2012 19:05:07
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Can we get some playoff talk going on in here?
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CoolHandLuke
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Posted on Fri Nov 30, 2012 01:35:04
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sure, ill make a prediction for 1 team....Cowboys will be superbowl champs.
of course, thats in my dreams.....
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SpazzyMcgee
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Posted on Fri Nov 30, 2012 03:46:35
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I was looking at the playoff picture earlier today, and saw that as it stands now, Indy would okay Denver in the Wild Card, that would be awesome!
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Chit
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Posted on Fri Nov 30, 2012 21:15:50
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By SpazzyMcgee [1519781]
I was looking at the playoff picture earlier today, and saw that as it stands now, Indy would okaywould be destroyed by Denver in the Wild Card, that would be awesome! |
Fixed.
Last Edited: Fri Nov 30, 2012 21:16:14
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SpazzyMcgee
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Posted on Sat Dec 01, 2012 01:25:27
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By Chit [1380260]
By SpazzyMcgee [1519781]
I was looking at the playoff picture earlier today, and saw that as it stands now, Indy would okaywould be destroyed by Denver in the Wild Card, that would be awesome! |
Fixed. |
I was on my phone, so "get" auto corrected to "okay" Dick!
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