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python

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Posted on Sat Oct 01, 2011 17:40:34
Where did u guys get these figures from I want to see them cos ched said norway won it in final seconds

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cappucino

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Posted on Sat Oct 01, 2011 17:44:50
By python [1009878]
Where did u guys get these figures from I want to see them cos ched said norway won it in final seconds


The numbers are still up on: http://www.torn.com/competitionworldwar.php

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RaReLy

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Posted on Sat Oct 01, 2011 17:48:38
By V1rus [19162]
ok lets put it this way what is the greater number

46 or 50?

so how on earth can 1.0334672021419 rounder up to 1.0035

be greater than 1.03350888062784 rounded down to 1.0035

you can take this to 100,000 matheticians and the answer will always be the same.

trying to say it isn't is like saying 46 is a bigger number than 50 or 467 is bigger than 508 etc


so norway with 1.03347
and 1.03551 meaning kuwait won... as the only thing determining the winner posted was ratio. No tiebreakers were announced and then this....

By Kaly [88506]
taken from the published list:
#1 norway - 30k attacks - 1.0335 ratio
#2 kuwait - 20k attacks - 1.0335 ratio
...
#5 cambodia - 8k attacks - 1.0330 ratio
#6 malaysia - 15k attacks - 1.0330 ratio

so, by what you are saying, if in case of a rounded tie, the winner is decided by the number of attacks, why is cambodia above malaysia ???


So obviously attacks wasn't the tiebreaker anyway which wasn't even announced to begin with meaning no fair way was determined for an issue like this.


By -Mickey- [511384]
I think the explanation is pretty simple:
The system based the winner and the whole competition since day one based on 4 decimals rounded, so in that case both Kuwait and Norway got the same 1.0335 ratio but Norway had more attacks so they got first with the tie.
I'm not saying that just because I was in Norway, I wasnt expecting to win, wouldnt care if didnt, I only wanted the two awards.
I also said on forums during the whole competition that Kuwait deserved to won.
I understand there it actually Kuwait got a better ratio with all the decimals but that wasnt how the competition was coded and so Norway did legit win based on the competition system.



So to sum things up Kuwait had a higher ratio and # of attacks was not a tiebreaker.
Hence Norway did no win legit as they did not have a higher ratio and # of attacks is not a tiebreaker.



Also too add, isn't there various things that only show the first few decimals but really is determined by more than those that are shown?

Last Edited: Sun Oct 02, 2011 00:27:15
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kyle8048

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Posted on Sat Oct 01, 2011 18:15:47
http://www.torn.com/competitionworldwar.php

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ah8idi_SPO1DdG5JNDUzT01yalhFZHFQdGNxNUdkMUE&hl=en_GB#gid=0

The numbers add up and kuwait has the highest ratio, must be some sort of error.


/end thread

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-Mickey-

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Posted on Sat Oct 01, 2011 18:58:55
By RatedR [72498]
By -Mickey- [511384]
It wasnt a mathematic error for god sake..it was ROUNDED, you can at most complain it was a tie and both countries won, but there is no way in hell you can say Kuwait won based on the system the whole competition had, it always were 4 decimals and it ended with 4 decimals, it makes no difference whatsoever if after the 4 digit Kuwait had a billion decimals higher than Norway, just round it up to 4 digits and both will have 1.0335
But I'm done with the discussion, either solution Ched brings up wont change anything on my Torn life anyways.


By your logic it should have been a draw then as both Norway and Kuwait had 1.0335 ratio,


I know, I said that on the post on General Discussion, just forget to say that here.
Kuwait can cry it was a tie, cant cry they won.
I think its funny how my mathematic principles is lacking and I can understand the simple rounding of a number to 4 decimails, but thats fine, I'm just a n00b anyways, only the people with over 100m have the right to understand how the game works and to post on forums, right H00D?

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kyle8048

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Posted on Sat Oct 01, 2011 19:01:17
By -Mickey- [511384]
By RatedR [72498]
By -Mickey- [511384]
It wasnt a mathematic error for god sake..it was ROUNDED, you can at most complain it was a tie and both countries won, but there is no way in hell you can say Kuwait won based on the system the whole competition had, it always were 4 decimals and it ended with 4 decimals, it makes no difference whatsoever if after the 4 digit Kuwait had a billion decimals higher than Norway, just round it up to 4 digits and both will have 1.0335
But I'm done with the discussion, either solution Ched brings up wont change anything on my Torn life anyways.


By your logic it should have been a draw then as both Norway and Kuwait had 1.0335 ratio,


I know, I said that on the post on General Discussion, just forget to say that here.
Kuwait can cry it was a tie, cant cry they won.
I think its funny how my mathematic principles is lacking and I can understand the simple rounding of a number to 4 decimails, but thats fine, I'm just a n00b anyways, only the people with over 100m have the right to understand how the game works and to post on forums, right H00D?


No-one is crying that we didnt win, just the fact we lost then. If its a tie its a tie, but we definitely didn't lose

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rapid_riser

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Posted on Sat Oct 01, 2011 19:19:36
By Kaly [88506]
By -Mickey- [511384]
I think the explanation is pretty simple:
The system based the winner and the whole competition since day one based on 4 decimals rounded, so in that case both Kuwait and Norway got the same 1.0335 ratio but Norway had more attacks so they got first with the tie.
I'm not saying that just because I was in Norway, I wasnt expecting to win, wouldnt care if didnt, I only wanted the two awards.
I also said on forums during the whole competition that Kuwait deserved to won.
I understand there it actually Kuwait got a better ratio with all the decimals but that wasnt how the competition was coded and so Norway did legit win based on the competition system.


taken from the published list:
#1 norway - 30k attacks - 1.0335 ratio
#2 kuwait - 20k attacks - 1.0335 ratio
...
#5 cambodia - 8k attacks - 1.0330 ratio
#6 malaysia - 15k attacks - 1.0330 ratio

so, by what you are saying, if in case of a rounded tie, the winner is decided by the number of attacks, why is cambodia above malaysia ???


The published list (http://www.torn.com/competitionworldwar.php) simply sorted by _rounded_ ratio. Number of attacks is clearly irrelevent to the listing. In the case of the rounded ratio being equal then the sort does not care which is shown first. The listing of those would down to vagaries of sort algorithm, such as order of the pre-sorted list and the sorting of other ratio's not even close, effectively _random_. This has been seen in the sorting of the hall of fame for top levels etc on subsequent refreshes of the page.

As is often the case although Kuwait has technically won, the official winner is Norway.

Anyone remember the Gore-Bush elections?


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H00D

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Posted on Sat Oct 01, 2011 19:27:51
By -Mickey- [511384]
By RatedR [72498]
By -Mickey- [511384]
It wasnt a mathematic error for god sake..it was ROUNDED, you can at most complain it was a tie and both countries won, but there is no way in hell you can say Kuwait won based on the system the whole competition had, it always were 4 decimals and it ended with 4 decimals, it makes no difference whatsoever if after the 4 digit Kuwait had a billion decimals higher than Norway, just round it up to 4 digits and both will have 1.0335
But I'm done with the discussion, either solution Ched brings up wont change anything on my Torn life anyways.


By your logic it should have been a draw then as both Norway and Kuwait had 1.0335 ratio,


I know, I said that on the post on General Discussion, just forget to say that here.
Kuwait can cry it was a tie, cant cry they won.
I think its funny how my mathematic principles is lacking and I can understand the simple rounding of a number to 4 decimails, but thats fine, I'm just a n00b anyways, only the people with over 100m have the right to understand how the game works and to post on forums, right H00D?


Kuwait isn't crying they just felt they were cheated out of the top spot because looking at the actual standings and unrounded (more accurate) ratios Kuwait did have the highest ratio, and that the competition ended just as Kuwait fell after holding the top spot for a good period just before the competition closed, which brings in the question, whether it was a coincidence or just a completely flawed, half assed system, which is not surprising from the king of the n00bs, chedburn as torn history frequently shows.

Onto your other claim that people with under 100m cannot have the right to understand the game is completely retarded, looking at previous cases such as players like YoungBlaze, Two, wall_street and many others, they managed to obtain a very good understanding of the game at such a young age. So that comment is invalid. Also many players with over 100m+ are complete n00bs aswell.

Anyone can get a good understanding of the game and anybody can post in the forum there is no rule saying 1 cannot post in the forums other than rules of what you post. This system is not the hardest thing to work out, you only need a few braincells and actually think about it. Experience does help alot, hence why these older players know alot about the game, this is because they have been through it and seen it all

But judging by your recent posts the only piece of truth in your posts I can pull out would be what I have bolded for you

Last Edited: Sat Oct 01, 2011 19:30:43
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Shadowice

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Posted on Sat Oct 01, 2011 19:36:30
By -Mickey- [511384]
By RatedR [72498]
By -Mickey- [511384]
It wasnt a mathematic error for god sake..it was ROUNDED, you can at most complain it was a tie and both countries won, but there is no way in hell you can say Kuwait won based on the system the whole competition had, it always were 4 decimals and it ended with 4 decimals, it makes no difference whatsoever if after the 4 digit Kuwait had a billion decimals higher than Norway, just round it up to 4 digits and both will have 1.0335
But I'm done with the discussion, either solution Ched brings up wont change anything on my Torn life anyways.


By your logic it should have been a draw then as both Norway and Kuwait had 1.0335 ratio,


I know, I said that on the post on General Discussion, just forget to say that here.
Kuwait can cry it was a tie, cant cry they won.
I think its funny how my mathematic principles is lacking and I can understand the simple rounding of a number to 4 decimails, but thats fine, I'm just a n00b anyways, only the people with over 100m have the right to understand how the game works and to post on forums, right H00D?


its like you dont read anything you just talk trash. ched said highest ratio would win, the math has been shown the highest ratio got 2nd place. 100m stats doesnt have anything to do with understanding math, so maybe instead of talking like you know whats going on you should go pull out your calculator and see that you didnt really win like you think you have. Kuwait was fine with a top 10 finish, which we got achieved we arent fine with being knocked down to 2nd place when we have the highest ratio.

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Marc

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Posted on Sat Oct 01, 2011 19:38:17
Moving back to top and locking so it doesn't become a bitching contest

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-Clansdancer

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Posted on Sun Oct 02, 2011 10:59:33
The winner is determined by ratio (rounded to 4 decimal points), ordered by total wins. Which puts Norway at top.

That's just how the system was, we will definitely work to change it next year so it's more accurate. But the results are as they are shown on the world war page and the winner will remain Norway.


Thanks

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Kaly

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Posted on Sun Oct 02, 2011 11:09:45
pardon me, but if this is more than a post-war made up excuse for why norway is on top of kuwait, then please explain why is cambodia on top of malaysia ? (read my above given details)

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kyle8048

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Posted on Sun Oct 02, 2011 11:25:08
I opened a bug report on this and It was closed with what I believe to be the wrong information so would just like a second look.

By RatedR [72498]
By Greatest [1388761]
1.033467202141901 - norway
1.03350888062784 - kuwait

I think we should have won.

Flag Wins Losses Ratio
1 Norway 30,108 29,133 1.0335
2 Kuwait 20,017 19,368 1.0335


And:

By Chedburn [1]
For the rest of the month, you will live by that flag, fight for that flag and if needed.. die for that flag. You, and others holding the same flag as you, must fight for pride. Attack, mug or hospitalize people holding different flags to boost your win/loss ratio. The followers of the flag which has the best ratio at the end of the month will receive prizes.


So yes, indeed.

Confirmed.


This shows Kuwait had the better ratio but if rounded to the 4th dp they were tied first

all my numbers are from here

http://www.torn.com/competitionworldwar.php

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ah8idi_SPO1DdG5JNDUzT01yalhFZHFQdGNxNUdkMUE&hl=en_GB#gid=0


By -Clansdancer [65306]
The winner is determined by ratio (rounded to 4 decimal points), ordered by total wins. Which puts Norway at top.

That's just how the system was, we will definitely work to change it next year so it's more accurate. But the results are as they are shown on the world war page and the winner will remain Norway.

Thanks


By Kaly [88506]
taken from the published list:
#1 norway - 30k attacks - 1.0335 ratio
#2 kuwait - 20k attacks - 1.0335 ratio
...
#5 cambodia - 8k attacks - 1.0330 ratio
#6 malaysia - 15k attacks - 1.0330 ratio

so, by what you are saying, if in case of a rounded tie, the winner is decided by the number of attacks, why is cambodia above malaysia ???


Unless it is double standards for 1st/2nd place than it is for 5th/6th that reason does not hold up and I would love someone to take a second look.


I would like it reopened before I make a new thread.

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H00D

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Posted on Sun Oct 02, 2011 14:12:51
By -Clansdancer [65306]
The winner is determined by ratio (rounded to 4 decimal points), ordered by total wins. Which puts Norway at top.

That's just how the system was, we will definitely work to change it next year so it's more accurate. But the results are as they are shown on the world war page and the winner will remain Norway.


Thanks


Hang on 1 minute it said that the flag with the highest ratio at the end would be the winner did it not? It said nothing about attacks won, you making up excuses again? You can't say 1 thing and do the other especially when you can't even do the other just look at Cambodia and Malaysia, so that reason was obviously made up to save face. Plus it is too unfair to rank it by attacks won seeing as their were not fair numbers in either country and nothing was stated about anything of attacks won involved in the results just whoever had the best ratio (which was Kuwait which you cannot debate.)

Can we atleast get a better excuse than that ?

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