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RatedR

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Posted on Fri Jan 22, 2010 12:08:09
Why not keep the gains for the attacker the same, but lower the respect that is taken? That could possibly satisfy both parties.

At the moment the gains as an attacker are quite poor. While I understand why that is, I also see why an aggresive farction gets upset when they only get 2 respect for a hit.

My suggestion would be to make the gains better, while the losses stay to how they are now.



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Ando

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Posted on Fri Jan 22, 2010 14:54:21
GOOD

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War_Warrior

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Posted on Fri Jan 22, 2010 15:58:04
I THINK THERE SHOULD BE A VOTE THING WHERE IF PEOPLE LIKE THIS UPDATE THEN THEY SHOULD VOTE YES AND IF THEY DONT THEN THEY SHOULD VOTE NO!1!

I THINK CHEDBURN HAS RUNNED THE FUN ABOUT CHAININNG IT MADE UNFAIR FOR THE HIGHER LVS COME ON PEOPLE CANT U SEE SEE THIS

I AM OT THE ONLY 1 THAT CAN SEE U LOSING PLAYERS OVER THIS AND I CAN ALSO SEE U GETTING A HELL LOAD OF MULTIES FOR SURE



I VOTE NO COME ON PEOPLE JOIN ME IN SAYING THIS A RUBBISH UPDATE !!!!!!!!!!!!


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Ravenous1

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Posted on Fri Jan 22, 2010 16:15:18
yes it is a rubbish update,ched wants to do what he wants and thats kill off chaining and faction wars.when will you people see that.

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Foxxeh

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Posted on Fri Jan 22, 2010 20:04:41
By D3ADLY [282188]

Well Cheddy. Have a look at what making a low level newbie get hit for almost the same respect as a much higher level person might do. Two here, is a level 5...


[6:12am] <@Two> meh Reno
[6:12am] <@Two> if Chedburn continues with his stupid suggestion
[6:12am] <@Two> of same respect for all levels
[6:12am] <@Two> I might guit warring
[6:12am] <@Two> it doesn't seem fair to me
[6:13am] <@Two> that I get hit for 2 respect and kae with 300 mill stats gethit for the same respect
[6:13am] <~D3ADLY> yeah sounds retarded.
[6:14am] <~D3ADLY> I might quit too.
[6:14am] <@Two> well I don't know about you
[6:14am] <@Two> you have the stats to defend
[6:14am] <@Two> I don't
[6:15am] <@Two> so do the rest of the other millions of noobs here on Torn
[6:15am] <~D3ADLY> well I am much sexxier than you.
[6:15am] <@Two> pssh thats crap
[6:15am] <~D3ADLY> nuh uhhh.
[6:16am] <@Two> totally




So if the goal was to get more newbs warring, perhaps that might not be the best thing? Of course he could drop ranks and go to a new faction and war people similar to his stats, but he. as most others, have friends already and I'd imagine they'd want to war with. As in Two's example, us.

I would imagine by my own personal opinion, low level newbs would become a much sought after target to hit. For example...

If I had the choice to attempt to hit a level 50 (Which I might/might not win) or a level 8 (Which is pretty much a guaranteed win) for nearly the same respect gain - slightly less, most people would hit that level 8 for the guaranteed win. I don't think this will be much fun for lower level being the #1 choice to get pounded on.


I've not read all the post yet here so don't know if it was mentioned. Just something to kick around if it hasn't.


Hi Foxxeh!


Hi Reno

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bootysnatcher
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Posted on Fri Jan 22, 2010 22:04:09
By Chedburn [1]
Weve been hard at work thinking up ways to make faction warring more fun and less of an endless pain for factions who cant defend themselves. We will be slowly adding changes in to see how they go, and carefully viewing the results. We will continue this until we feel the system is perfect. Each change will be announced as usual.

Today weve done the following:

-Factions with under 100 respect will now lose respect much slower. This change makes it not worthwhile for factions to completely kill off others for respect alone, but is certainly still possible if you have something to prove.

-Respect gain multiplier has been changed. Before, it was a simple calculation: Level x value. For example, attacking a level 60 would yield 60 times more respect than a level 1. We have evened this out so that a level 1 for example, yields four times less than a level 70 (instead of 70 times less). This should result in fewer factions purposely inviting low levels in to their faction just to lower their rank without repercussions. This also lowers the need to level hold, users no longer need to feel restricted when wanting to level up. Ranks will still offer protection for lower levels with less stats.

There are many changes we must make to the system to make it enjoyable for everyone, not just the HOF guys, not just the newbies. Were going to find a suitable average that hopefully sits well with everyone.

Thanks.



Edited by: Chedburn on 20/01/10 at 8:23:30 AM



Good update...my newer players are more active then ever...

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-Sparks-

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Posted on Sat Jan 23, 2010 01:58:52
By Chedburn [1]
Also as a note: The fireworks company special will not work on factions below 100 respect.


Since you have changed it, you may as well do it properly and get rid of pyro all together. Give the ones working in a firework stand a better special instead of making the only worthwhile one practically useless.

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Ravenous1

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Posted on Sat Jan 23, 2010 02:45:23
By cranium [856568]
By Chedburn [1]
Weve been hard at work thinking up ways to make faction warring more fun and less of an endless pain for factions who cant defend themselves. We will be slowly adding changes in to see how they go, and carefully viewing the results. We will continue this until we feel the system is perfect. Each change will be announced as usual.

Today weve done the following:

-Factions with under 100 respect will now lose respect much slower. This change makes it not worthwhile for factions to completely kill off others for respect alone, but is certainly still possible if you have something to prove.

-Respect gain multiplier has been changed. Before, it was a simple calculation: Level x value. For example, attacking a level 60 would yield 60 times more respect than a level 1. We have evened this out so that a level 1 for example, yields four times less than a level 70 (instead of 70 times less). This should result in fewer factions purposely inviting low levels in to their faction just to lower their rank without repercussions. This also lowers the need to level hold, users no longer need to feel restricted when wanting to level up. Ranks will still offer protection for lower levels with less stats.

There are many changes we must make to the system to make it enjoyable for everyone, not just the HOF guys, not just the newbies. Were going to find a suitable average that hopefully sits well with everyone.

Thanks.



Edited by: Chedburn on 20/01/10 at 8:23:30 AM



Good update...my newer players are more active then ever...


how is this a good update?
is it going to make people go aggressive that are in a peaceful faction? NO it wont
like i said before peaceful faction should have a timer set in them and as soon as you start using respect for faction specials it should count down to go aggressive.

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Eclipse22

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Posted on Sat Jan 23, 2010 08:37:03
:@

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Autolycus
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Posted on Sat Jan 23, 2010 08:43:21
By -sparks- [753136]
By Chedburn [1]
Also as a note: The fireworks company special will not work on factions below 100 respect.


Since you have changed it, you may as well do it properly and get rid of pyro all together. Give the ones working in a firework stand a better special instead of making the only worthwhile one practically useless.


Watch....we're gonna get stuck with 1000 dollars per job point.

BUYING: Cheap stuff. Selling: Stuff in my bazaar.
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shari
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Posted on Sat Jan 23, 2010 17:28:21
sounds good

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RainbowDash

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Posted on Sat Jan 23, 2010 23:44:43
chedburn.... i love you

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PopadaPill

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Posted on Sun Jan 24, 2010 00:32:09
By Foxxeh [733751]
By D3ADLY [282188]

Well Cheddy. Have a look at what making a low level newbie get hit for almost the same respect as a much higher level person might do. Two here, is a level 5...


[6:12am] <@Two> meh Reno
[6:12am] <@Two> if Chedburn continues with his stupid suggestion
[6:12am] <@Two> of same respect for all levels
[6:12am] <@Two> I might guit warring
[6:12am] <@Two> it doesn't seem fair to me
[6:13am] <@Two> that I get hit for 2 respect and kae with 300 mill stats gethit for the same respect
[6:13am] <~D3ADLY> yeah sounds retarded.
[6:14am] <~D3ADLY> I might quit too.
[6:14am] <@Two> well I don't know about you
[6:14am] <@Two> you have the stats to defend
[6:14am] <@Two> I don't
[6:15am] <@Two> so do the rest of the other millions of noobs here on Torn
[6:15am] <~D3ADLY> well I am much sexxier than you.
[6:15am] <@Two> pssh thats crap
[6:15am] <~D3ADLY> nuh uhhh.
[6:16am] <@Two> totally




So if the goal was to get more newbs warring, perhaps that might not be the best thing? Of course he could drop ranks and go to a new faction and war people similar to his stats, but he. as most others, have friends already and I'd imagine they'd want to war with. As in Two's example, us.

I would imagine by my own personal opinion, low level newbs would become a much sought after target to hit. For example...

If I had the choice to attempt to hit a level 50 (Which I might/might not win) or a level 8 (Which is pretty much a guaranteed win) for nearly the same respect gain - slightly less, most people would hit that level 8 for the guaranteed win. I don't think this will be much fun for lower level being the #1 choice to get pounded on.


I've not read all the post yet here so don't know if it was mentioned. Just something to kick around if it hasn't.


Hi Foxxeh!


Hi Reno


I agree,not good.


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AlenKapic
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Posted on Sun Jan 24, 2010 03:23:28
fdd

i am a nice person,i like to have a joke or two.Everthing about me is cool,i like sports,i like torn,i love just about anything
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C2jojoNotWarrng

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Posted on Sun Jan 24, 2010 03:42:42
I think it would be good if the war between two factions would eliminate the worst performers for each day until you have the best of each faction (winning-est) fight for the crown or something . Just the beginning of an idea but I think it would be fun.

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Marmaduke
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Posted on Sun Jan 24, 2010 05:31:22
By MurderDeathKill [299282]
By Bruce_Parry [868541]
-Factions with under 100 respect will now lose respect much slower.

Which makes it far easier to keep the faction in hospital for a lot longer because the slower loss or respect means the faction is in the warbase for a longer period of time

-Respect gain multiplier has been changed. Before, it was a simple calculation: Level x value. For example, attacking a level 60 would yield 60 times more respect than a level 1. We have evened this out so that a level 1 for example, yields four times less than a level 60 (instead of 60 times less).

Sry but that is the lamest update ever..a lvl 1 should yield 60 x less respect than a lvl 60

This should result in HOF factions now attacking much higher lvl's...say lvl 20's

All in all these changes benefit the few and not the most



Edited by: Bruce_Parry on 21/01/10 at 1:05:17 PM


If your faction is dying too slowly you can always delete it. And the reason lvl 1's give up the same respect is because people are only using them to drop ranks. Most of these lvl ones in factions are over a month inactive, why are you whining about them for?


Because the lvl 1's being allowed to help factions to drop ranks was a lame idea to begin with and this just further underlines the point that there needs to be a serious overhaul of the faction ranking system.
So if lower lvl's are the cause of this then alter the way the faction ranks are calculated, the way it's been altered could make a genuine lower level faction a better target due to higher respect gains..so keep respect gains per level to make it simpler




Edited by: Bruce_Parry on 24/01/10 at 5:34:50 AM

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backhere2
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Posted on Sun Jan 24, 2010 14:52:28
:)

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PopadaPill

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Posted on Sun Jan 24, 2010 16:18:53
The idea about a level 8 being the same(or thereabouts) as a level 50 is just crackers to me.Do the staff think so as they play the game?I wouldn't want be a low level if this happens put it that way as they will get a raw deal,the level holders make use of less hp for the benefit of a few things,this will wipe the best out.Why hit a level you will struggle against when you can beat up a lvl 5....madness dont do it.

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-Cindy-
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Posted on Sun Jan 24, 2010 17:15:47
Unfortunately, most people assume that all factions are using low levels just to adjust the rank. Many of the low levels in factions are chaining and helping out, or they were until this update was introduced to us.

I cannot speak for all factions but I know for a fact that both Ninja faction and BAMF have new players levels 1-10 that are chaining and attacking.

I am having a hard time understanding why lower levels are now being punished for joining stronger factions. The system should be reworked and tweaked to allow any player to join any faction that they are accepted into without feeling as if they will hurt the faction because of their level.

This update just made several lower levels that were active and chaining leave their factions.


Edited by: -Cindy- on 24/01/10 at 5:32:07 PM

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ImTheN00B

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Posted on Sun Jan 24, 2010 23:15:31
well i guess from now on in wars we'll be throwing bricks at level 1's cus it is the same as attacking a higher level. this is crap.

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brett2k07

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Posted on Mon Jan 25, 2010 07:10:25
I believe the intent was good, but the result was a major fail...

I want so bad to go aggressive with my faction, but I refuse to unless the ranking system was overhauled...i read this with hopes that maybe just maybe that was what happened...boy was i disappointed

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EasterRabbit

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Posted on Mon Jan 25, 2010 13:22:21
IMO I think its been a good update. Practically, it makes it more appealing to me to chain, as you don't have to focus as much on hosping people higher level than you. I saw an opposing faction fight us back, hitting on lots of our low levels, and they were still able to grab a chunk of respect. Seems quite fair and more fun for all now.

I make to u to sig like to this fro $10000.

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HellBoy69
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Posted on Mon Jan 25, 2010 14:46:42
A few suggestions for you ched
delete the faction rank system
make a player rank system based mainly on stats (and put level, age, respect gained, win/loss ratio and other things on the mix)
make it invisible (like leveling experience) so you can't guess the opponent stats just for their 'rank'

if you really want to keep the faction rank:
make members inactive for 30 days be auto-kicked from their faction
reduce the number of ranks
make respect less dependent from level and more from stats


PORTUGAL!!!

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Evil_Cockney

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Posted on Mon Jan 25, 2010 15:25:30
By Satanix [846690]
IMO I think its been a good update. Practically, it makes it more appealing to me to chain, as you don't have to focus as much on hosping people higher level than you. I saw an opposing faction fight us back, hitting on lots of our low levels, and they were still able to grab a chunk of respect. Seems quite fair and more fun for all now.


So now that you can hosp a level 5 for the same respect as a level 50 you think it's a "fairer" system !

Maybe you get some fun out of beating newbies all day but we don't. I've cancelled all our future chains until this "trial" gets tweaked further or more updates are added.

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g-had

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Posted on Mon Jan 25, 2010 18:16:10
By PopadaPill [900338]
By Foxxeh [733751]
By D3ADLY [282188]

Well Cheddy. Have a look at what making a low level newbie get hit for almost the same respect as a much higher level person might do. Two here, is a level 5...


[6:12am] <@Two> meh Reno
[6:12am] <@Two> if Chedburn continues with his stupid suggestion
[6:12am] <@Two> of same respect for all levels
[6:12am] <@Two> I might guit warring
[6:12am] <@Two> it doesn't seem fair to me
[6:13am] <@Two> that I get hit for 2 respect and kae with 300 mill stats gethit for the same respect
[6:13am] <~D3ADLY> yeah sounds retarded.
[6:14am] <~D3ADLY> I might quit too.
[6:14am] <@Two> well I don't know about you
[6:14am] <@Two> you have the stats to defend
[6:14am] <@Two> I don't
[6:15am] <@Two> so do the rest of the other millions of noobs here on Torn
[6:15am] <~D3ADLY> well I am much sexxier than you.
[6:15am] <@Two> pssh thats crap
[6:15am] <~D3ADLY> nuh uhhh.
[6:16am] <@Two> totally




So if the goal was to get more newbs warring, perhaps that might not be the best thing? Of course he could drop ranks and go to a new faction and war people similar to his stats, but he. as most others, have friends already and I'd imagine they'd want to war with. As in Two's example, us.

I would imagine by my own personal opinion, low level newbs would become a much sought after target to hit. For example...

If I had the choice to attempt to hit a level 50 (Which I might/might not win) or a level 8 (Which is pretty much a guaranteed win) for nearly the same respect gain - slightly less, most people would hit that level 8 for the guaranteed win. I don't think this will be much fun for lower level being the #1 choice to get pounded on.


I've not read all the post yet here so don't know if it was mentioned. Just something to kick around if it hasn't.


Hi Foxxeh!


Hi Reno


I agree,not good.


I disagree and agree. It was a good update that lower levels now cost respect, 1-2 respect per hit but lowering the respect for a level 50 is ridiculous. Should of kept the respect gained the same for higher levels. Theres just no point in trying the 50/50 chance or even 10% chance win any more. No fun :

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Azriel

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Posted on Mon Jan 25, 2010 18:18:39
Good job its only a "trail" because this sucks!

Lets hope what ever you come up with for the final is better then this.

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-Cindy-
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Posted on Mon Jan 25, 2010 18:35:06
By g-had [98956]
I disagree and agree. It was a good update that lower levels now cost respect, 1-2 respect per hit but lowering the respect for a level 50 is ridiculous. Should of kept the respect gained the same for higher levels. Theres just no point in trying the 50/50 chance or even 10% chance win any more. No fun :


Maybe it is a good thing that new players can be attacked for respect but, those who are new and active and chaining cannot get out of the hospital long enough to make their attacks and chain properly before being fisted by levels 50 and up.

Of course the attackers level is unimportant but, the little guys cannot keep up in decent factions anymore. I don't think they should be punished for being in stronger factions who are teaching them to chain.

I thought that the goal was to make warring more attractive to all players.

Edit: All of these little updates, trail updates, changes and tweaking to factions are not going to help warring system until the way factions are broken up into ranks is reworked.

Players with 1 million total stats= Rank 1
Players with 10 billion total stats= Rank 1

^This is the problem, this is why factions recruit new players. This is also why peaceful players stay away from warring.


Edited by: -Cindy- on 25/01/10 at 6:43:49 PM

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EasterRabbit

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Posted on Mon Jan 25, 2010 18:46:09
By Evil_Cockney [420168]
By Satanix [846690]
IMO I think its been a good update. Practically, it makes it more appealing to me to chain, as you don't have to focus as much on hosping people higher level than you. I saw an opposing faction fight us back, hitting on lots of our low levels, and they were still able to grab a chunk of respect. Seems quite fair and more fun for all now.


So now that you can hosp a level 5 for the same respect as a level 50 you think it's a "fairer" system !

Maybe you get some fun out of beating newbies all day but we don't. I've cancelled all our future chains until this "trial" gets tweaked further or more updates are added.


But you dont get the same respect for hosping a level 5 as you do lvl 50.
Fairer because the lower levels in a faction can make a significant contribution too.

I make to u to sig like to this fro $10000.

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brett2k07

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Posted on Mon Jan 25, 2010 19:46:36
By -Cindy- [747490]
By g-had [98956]
I disagree and agree. It was a good update that lower levels now cost respect, 1-2 respect per hit but lowering the respect for a level 50 is ridiculous. Should of kept the respect gained the same for higher levels. Theres just no point in trying the 50/50 chance or even 10% chance win any more. No fun :


Maybe it is a good thing that new players can be attacked for respect but, those who are new and active and chaining cannot get out of the hospital long enough to make their attacks and chain properly before being fisted by levels 50 and up.

Of course the attackers level is unimportant but, the little guys cannot keep up in decent factions anymore. I don't think they should be punished for being in stronger factions who are teaching them to chain.

I thought that the goal was to make warring more attractive to all players.

Edit: All of these little updates, trail updates, changes and tweaking to factions are not going to help warring system until the way factions are broken up into ranks is reworked.

Players with 1 million total stats= Rank 1
Players with 10 billion total stats= Rank 1

^This is the problem, this is why factions recruit new players. This is also why peaceful players stay away from warring.


Edited by: -Cindy- on 25/01/10 at 6:43:49 PM


IMO newbie players who join up with the big boys should have to play with the big boys. If a lvl 10 joins up with a bunch of lvl 40's who are warring factions, they should know that they are going to get pounded. You have the ability to look and see who they are at war with before you join up. If you choose to go ahead with it, then it's your own fault. So, i think the bigger respect gains for lower lvls is a good thing.

On the other hand.....

The ranking system is completely and utterly screwed right now. My faction is a rank 3 yet 8 out of the 20 HOF factions are lower ranks than us. We would get stomped if we went up against any of those factions. Sure, i could add a bunch of level 1s and 5s to drop our rank, but what's the point when 6 out of those 8 are at or below rank 5? We would still get pummeled.

I've been thinking about some sort of average system for the entire tribe, based solely on stats, because that's what matters when it comes to warring. Not levels, not age, not money, completely and utterly stats. Rather than ranks being taken away, I think ranks need to be added. Then give like a respect penalty for dropping anywhere below 2 ranks than what you are already at, the further you drop, the bigger the penalty gets sorta thing. This gives the opportunity for members to leave or quit without the faction getting penalized. It will also deter rank dropping. I dunno, it's just a thought, and VERY rough idea to maybe try and make things a little more fair. LOTS of stuff still needs to be ironed out, and nothing is set in stone (or paper for that matter).

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Evil_Cockney

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Posted on Mon Jan 25, 2010 20:24:07
By Satanix [846690]
By Evil_Cockney [420168]
By Satanix [846690]
IMO I think its been a good update. Practically, it makes it more appealing to me to chain, as you don't have to focus as much on hosping people higher level than you. I saw an opposing faction fight us back, hitting on lots of our low levels, and they were still able to grab a chunk of respect. Seems quite fair and more fun for all now.


So now that you can hosp a level 5 for the same respect as a level 50 you think it's a "fairer" system !

Maybe you get some fun out of beating newbies all day but we don't. I've cancelled all our future chains until this "trial" gets tweaked further or more updates are added.


But you dont get the same respect for hosping a level 5 as you do lvl 50.
Fairer because the lower levels in a faction can make a significant contribution too.


I beg to differ.

We chained last week and got 2 respect for hosp'ing a level 50 and then a few hits later we also got 2 respect for hosp'ing a level 4.

There may have been a fractional variation between the two that isn't visible because there are no decimal places shown but the difference is still minimal.

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Forum Main>>Announcements>> Faction warring Trial and error
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