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Forum Main>>Announcements>> Warning: Faction scamming laws
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delgoffe-TA

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Posted on Mon Jun 14, 2010 22:02:15
a response to ched ..
These steps have been put in to action for many reasons. Mainly:

We do not take any action against company scamming, why factions?
-how to scam a company ? only the owner has the faculty of removing money ...

The huge difficulty staff go through to resolve these issues.
-tc is based on my-sql , that's verry hard to made a select * from table ???

The instant by-passing of warnings.
-many players have warnings for bad tip , check my ones , i've made copy-paste of it on my display

The inability to determine who owns the money.
-Same response , mySql , select ..

learn informatic ched , or have good staff ...
you can hire me for free ( just for the special collectible)



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delgoffe-TA

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Posted on Mon Jun 14, 2010 22:07:58
I forgot one ..
how to don't be scammed with a faction ... change the rules of co-leadership ... that's easy no ?

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FrOsTy

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Posted on Mon Jun 14, 2010 22:08:27
We do not take any action against company scamming, why factions?
-how to scam a company ? only the owner has the faculty of removing money


It's not the cash in companies it's the ones that fall for scams like Hey if you let me be director of your company i can make it 5 stars in 10mins and then i'll give you it back i charge only 1 mil.

And sadly yes there has been many players that has fallen for just that. End up with any cash stored in there gone + their company.




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PsychoKitty

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Posted on Mon Jun 14, 2010 22:11:37
There's no way to protect people from their own stupidity.

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FrOsTy

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Posted on Mon Jun 14, 2010 22:12:58
By PsychoKitty [1015147]
There's no way to protect people from their own stupidity.


Best post i have seen in here.



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299282
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Posted on Mon Jun 14, 2010 22:27:29
By FrOsTy [215567]
Come back when you have a clue about what staff do. Im a mod i mod forums and other player content as well as help questions and other things. Sec's used to deal with faction theft and scam's and wow i don't see many sec's posting in here. Ya want to know why? Because they are busy doing other staff duties.


Hire more staff! For some reason 40-50 staff is all we've ever had, i realise there is a high turnover from corrupt, inactive and otherwise unproductive staff but the staff to player ratio is about 1 staff per 1000 players, thats a bit low compared to other games that have that many staff and only 1-2k players.

I guess the next excuse will be that there are not enough qualified people to be staff, i doubt that.

Sometimes its just easier to mute them then own up to your own mistakes!!
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-Cindy-
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Posted on Mon Jun 14, 2010 22:28:53
Who has the time to be a staff member? >.<

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trueamerican
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Posted on Mon Jun 14, 2010 23:17:40
That is messed up man. You got my condolences...

By Valesh [96818]
So since it starts on the 12th... it was illegal what happened today and will be dealt with right?


Here is why this can't be allowed to happen


Theft from faction bank/armoury
Taking cash/points/items in a faction without the leaders approval, gaining leadership under false pretenses and refusing to return control of the faction to the rightful leader etc.


I was told by a couple secretaries, that this was not a faction theft. The reason behind this is that said player sent me 90billion of my own money while I was sleeping. Since he had access to the faction bank (with his 5bil in the faction) it was ok for him to send me my 90billion while I was sleeping, while he had muggers ready.

The point here is this. I did NOT give him permission to touch MY money in the faction. By giving me my money, he was putting his hands on my money, not his. Thus stealing my money from the faction to send to me. This was not his to do so with, especially without my permission. As said in the above rule, Theft from Faction Bank/Amoury.

Now lets throw another point out there. Since I didn't send the money to myself, who is to say that that money was mine to begin with that he sent?? Perhaps it was the factions cash, not mine? Thus JusticeR just stole 90b from the Affliction faction, and sent it to me (Valesh). Thus I should still have 90billion in the faction.. as it wasn't my money that was sent to me at all, as I didn't send it nor authorize that I wanted MY... so there is no ownership of that money, besides to say that it is from the Affliction faction, not JusticeRs money... that we know for sure. So he did steal 85billion from the faction to send to me (Valesh). Thus JusticeR should be fedded for faction theft, as it wasn't his money, nor mine that he sent me.. but money that was the factions.


Game Bug Abuse
Failing to report a fluke/loophole in the game and taking advantage of it is forbidden.


This brings me to my third and almostfinal point. It is obvious that this was set up by said player who mugged me first (Sifonjer) and said player who sent me the cash (JusticeR). Exactly 23 seconds after the cash was given out, I was mugged, until that 90billion turned into 13million, all the while I am sleeping. So since this is a gray area, with no set code of rules, it is obviously a loophole that has been exploited. See rule here... as they knew that staff would say that there is nothing they can do about it.

Thus, both of them should be fedded.

05/06/10
11:58:35 PM Valesh was given $90,650,000,000 from the Faction.
And of course the muggings go on until there is nothing left to be mugged.


05/06/10
11:58:58 PM Someone mugged Valesh
05/06/10
11:59:42 PM Someone mugged Valesh

My final point, is this. By allowing this to happen, staff, admin and rule setters are allowing this to be a precedent that is being set... making this OK to happen to everyone. Is this really a rule you want to be ok with? Not being able to trust anyone with access to the faction? Obviously multiple rules have been broken here, by multiple players that should punished. By not punishing them, and allowing this to happen, this is only going to get worse and happen more often.




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Kraken

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Posted on Mon Jun 14, 2010 23:57:39
By PsychoKitty [1015147]
There's no way to protect people from their own stupidity.


Was Valesh stupid?

You can't call someone stupid for being back stabbed by someone who they trusted.

A noob giving his company or faction to a guy who he never had any kind of interaction cause he said he would turn it 5 stars in 10 mins IS STUPID.

Being backstabbed by a person who you played with by months and had a string of trust. THAT IS NOT STUPID.

Those are way different cases and cant be judged equaly.

Last Edited: Tue Jun 15, 2010 00:00:31
I'm the noob adopted by Passie_ [936578]
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aerozol

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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 00:43:12
By Krawsler [936081]
Was Valesh stupid?

You can't call someone stupid for being back stabbed by someone who they trusted.

He wasn't stupid because what was done to him was covered by the rules at the time. Staff just said it was a 'loophole', but it clearly wasn't, as the text in the rules covered exactly what happened.

But this had happened to him before apparently, and staff warned him about it, and then he did it again (apparently).. So maybe a little careless?

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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 01:20:41
By Krawsler [936081]
By PsychoKitty [1015147]
There's no way to protect people from their own stupidity.


Was Valesh stupid?

You can't call someone stupid for being back stabbed by someone who they trusted.

A noob giving his company or faction to a guy who he never had any kind of interaction cause he said he would turn it 5 stars in 10 mins IS STUPID.

Being backstabbed by a person who you played with by months and had a string of trust. THAT IS NOT STUPID.

Those are way different cases and cant be judged equaly.


Your also forgetting he couldn't tell who withdrew the money, could have been anyone in the faction

Sometimes its just easier to mute them then own up to your own mistakes!!
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FrOsTy

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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 01:45:22
Yeah i wouldn't go as far as to call anyone stupid as in the case with Valesh, careless maybe but not stupid. I think what the op was referring to was after the rule change, not when the faction scamming rules where in place. I could be wrong tho as im not a mind reader. This is where we all will find out who the solid people are unless Ched decides to implement something in game to curb faction theft or tools to help better prevent it. Who knows we will just have to wait and see. Now that we know the rules have been changed and someone decides hey i dont know this person very well, but i think i may be able to trust them the seem like a good person and they get bit in the ass i would say that was a not so smart move. As to player's that have known each other for years as alot of us have and same thing happens i would go with more along the lines of unfortunate and add that person to the list of people to not be trusted.
I could know someone a long time and trust them 100% give them access and then that little thing called Greed sets in and they cant handle it and boom my ass is handed to me. I have said this before Greed can and will be the downfall of many.



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laurence54
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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 02:27:55
Staff edit.

Last Edited: Tue Jun 15, 2010 02:33:33
10 Husbands, Still a Virgin

A lawyer married a woman who had previously divorced ten husbands.


On their wedding night, she told her new husband, "Please be gentle, I'm still a virgin."


"What?" said the puzzled groom.


"How can that be if you'
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laurence54
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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 02:29:01
Staff edit.


Last Edited: Tue Jun 15, 2010 02:34:20
10 Husbands, Still a Virgin

A lawyer married a woman who had previously divorced ten husbands.


On their wedding night, she told her new husband, "Please be gentle, I'm still a virgin."


"What?" said the puzzled groom.


"How can that be if you'
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laurence54
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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 02:29:51
Staff edit.

Last Edited: Tue Jun 15, 2010 02:34:54
10 Husbands, Still a Virgin

A lawyer married a woman who had previously divorced ten husbands.


On their wedding night, she told her new husband, "Please be gentle, I'm still a virgin."


"What?" said the puzzled groom.


"How can that be if you'
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Kraken

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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 02:53:23
By MurderDeathKill [299282]
By Krawsler [936081]
By PsychoKitty [1015147]
There's no way to protect people from their own stupidity.


Was Valesh stupid?

You can't call someone stupid for being back stabbed by someone who they trusted.

A noob giving his company or faction to a guy who he never had any kind of interaction cause he said he would turn it 5 stars in 10 mins IS STUPID.

Being backstabbed by a person who you played with by months and had a string of trust. THAT IS NOT STUPID.

Those are way different cases and cant be judged equaly.


Your also forgetting he couldn't tell who withdrew the money, could have been anyone in the faction


Uhm..I thought he clearly accused JusticeR for it.


I'm the noob adopted by Passie_ [936578]
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299282
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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 03:14:11
By Krawsler [936081]
By MurderDeathKill [299282]
By Krawsler [936081]
By PsychoKitty [1015147]
There's no way to protect people from their own stupidity.


Was Valesh stupid?

You can't call someone stupid for being back stabbed by someone who they trusted.

A noob giving his company or faction to a guy who he never had any kind of interaction cause he said he would turn it 5 stars in 10 mins IS STUPID.

Being backstabbed by a person who you played with by months and had a string of trust. THAT IS NOT STUPID.

Those are way different cases and cant be judged equaly.


Your also forgetting he couldn't tell who withdrew the money, could have been anyone in the faction


Uhm..I thought he clearly accused JusticeR for it.


It wasn't until the second time it happened that it was figured out who did it. Sif was giving a % to justicer and he was depositing it back into the faction so it wasn't to hard to figure out at that point.

And i guarentee justice would have had his treasury access removed if it was known who did it.

Sometimes its just easier to mute them then own up to your own mistakes!!
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Kraken

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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 03:26:44
Ah.. Well..

if it happened twice thats another case.. I would have removed everyone's access after the first time.

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_Matt123_
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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 07:32:35
By FrOsTy [215567]
Come back when you have a clue about what staff do. Im a mod i mod forums and other player content as well as help questions and other things. Sec's used to deal with faction theft and scam's and wow i don't see many sec's posting in here. Ya want to know why? Because they are busy doing other staff duties.


such as? Wiping their own arse? Staff do jack s**t in the game now yet they're unwilling to accept it

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MoRo
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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 12:29:44
By FrOsTy [215567]
Come back when you have a clue about what staff do. Im a mod i mod forums and other player content as well as help questions and other things. Sec's used to deal with faction theft and scam's and wow i don't see many sec's posting in here. Ya want to know why? Because they are busy doing other staff duties.


Oh... I like the "Questions and other things" and "other staff duties" part.
Do you want to know why ?
I had to fire a week ago (in RL) an employee that gave me an answer like that when I asked him what he was doing (of course that was not his first time, he was always doing "other things")

And Frosty, believe me, we mortals, don't need/want to know what you gods do.
We just don't care about that, It's your job, not ours.

WE JUST WANT THE JOB DONE, THAT'S ALL.

Need more staff for that? well, hire more staff for that, it's that simple.-


[
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Slick_Daddy

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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 19:19:57
man dude robbed me for alll my morphs and drugs, before the 12th or whatever, staff put him in fed, but i didnt get the items, contradiction in itself..o_O

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Sorrow_Awaits

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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 22:11:11
Why are people asking silly questions about shit like "Where can we store our money safely now that this rule has come in?"

Ummm, it's called starting a company with ONE employee, YOU.

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delgoffe-TA

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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 22:36:41
By Sorrow_Awaits [126091]
Why are people asking silly questions about shit like "Where can we store our money safely now that this rule has come in?"

Ummm, it's called starting a company with ONE employee, YOU.


hummm lol , and company hacking , do you know it ?

:*

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Chelios

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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 22:41:32
By delgoffe-TA [719787]
By Sorrow_Awaits [126091]
Why are people asking silly questions about shit like "Where can we store our money safely now that this rule has come in?"

Ummm, it's called starting a company with ONE employee, YOU.


hummm lol , and company hacking , do you know it ?

:*


And the SYS stock, do you know it?

:*


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mug

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Posted on Tue Jun 15, 2010 22:46:51
By Chelios [1381155]
By delgoffe-TA [719787]
By Sorrow_Awaits [126091]
Why are people asking silly questions about shit like "Where can we store our money safely now that this rule has come in?"

Ummm, it's called starting a company with ONE employee, YOU.


hummm lol , and company hacking , do you know it ?

:*


And the SYS stock, do you know it?

:*


scammers pwn all -- they'll just steal your SYS and then your company

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deathsline
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Posted on Wed Jun 16, 2010 04:56:33
lol

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299282
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Posted on Wed Jun 16, 2010 06:26:52
By FrOsTy [215567]
Yeah i wouldn't go as far as to call anyone stupid as in the case with Valesh, careless maybe but not stupid. I think what the op was referring to was after the rule change, not when the faction scamming rules where in place. I could be wrong tho as im not a mind reader. This is where we all will find out who the solid people are unless Ched decides to implement something in game to curb faction theft or tools to help better prevent it. Who knows we will just have to wait and see. Now that we know the rules have been changed and someone decides hey i dont know this person very well, but i think i may be able to trust them the seem like a good person and they get bit in the ass i would say that was a not so smart move. As to player's that have known each other for years as alot of us have and same thing happens i would go with more along the lines of unfortunate and add that person to the list of people to not be trusted.
I could know someone a long time and trust them 100% give them access and then that little thing called Greed sets in and they cant handle it and boom my ass is handed to me. I have said this before Greed can and will be the downfall of many.


Easy fix, make it so a player can't remove more then they have donated to the faction and a player cannot send faction money to another player unless they are faction leader or co-leader;)

Sometimes its just easier to mute them then own up to your own mistakes!!
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Boxxy

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Posted on Wed Jun 16, 2010 09:12:06

Easy fix, make it so a player can't remove more then they have donated to the faction and a player cannot send faction money to another player unless they are faction leader or co-leader;)


Then you have the same problem of 'Is my co trustworthy or not?' and I would say no unless you know them in real life, I wouldnt trust anyone with anything of mine unless I knew them personally


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May all of your pain be champagne!
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Charlie

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Posted on Wed Jun 16, 2010 14:51:50
By MurderDeathKill [299282]
By FrOsTy [215567]
Yeah i wouldn't go as far as to call anyone stupid as in the case with Valesh, careless maybe but not stupid. I think what the op was referring to was after the rule change, not when the faction scamming rules where in place. I could be wrong tho as im not a mind reader. This is where we all will find out who the solid people are unless Ched decides to implement something in game to curb faction theft or tools to help better prevent it. Who knows we will just have to wait and see. Now that we know the rules have been changed and someone decides hey i dont know this person very well, but i think i may be able to trust them the seem like a good person and they get bit in the ass i would say that was a not so smart move. As to player's that have known each other for years as alot of us have and same thing happens i would go with more along the lines of unfortunate and add that person to the list of people to not be trusted.
I could know someone a long time and trust them 100% give them access and then that little thing called Greed sets in and they cant handle it and boom my ass is handed to me. I have said this before Greed can and will be the downfall of many.


Easy fix, make it so a player can't remove more then they have donated to the faction and a player cannot send faction money to another player unless they are faction leader or co-leader;)


But then people would be unwillingly to put money in the faction bank, should the co/leader steals it. I often wonder why we don't just have one big pot for faction business (ie chaining) which can operate with the same system we have now, plus add personal vaults (or lockers, whatever) that only individual players have access to.

The amount stored in the "lockers" could increase with time in the faction?

Good idea? Or am I babbling?

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Passie

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Posted on Wed Jun 16, 2010 15:08:05
By IJustine [1310886]

Easy fix, make it so a player can't remove more then they have donated to the faction and a player cannot send faction money to another player unless they are faction leader or co-leader;)


Then you have the same problem of 'Is my co trustworthy or not?' and I would say no unless you know them in real life, I wouldnt trust anyone with anything of mine unless I knew them personally


Why have someone as your co-leader if you don't trust them in the first place? And you don't even have to assign a co-leader.

I like the locker-idea.

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